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CVC - Rugby Pioneers or Profiteer?

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Brizzer View Drop Down
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    Posted: 26 Feb 2020 at 18:22
I have just read an interesting article saying that not only is the CVC £300m purchase of 14% of the 6 nations due to go through in weeks, but that they are also planning a Club Rugby World Cup(reported in the Times I believe). If these are true, what will it mean for rugby as we know it? Will it lead to a ‘Super League’? Where would that leave club rugby in England? Especially in the PL which CVC already have a large holding in.
One thing is for sure, PE companies such as CVC (and they are one of the largest) do not invest into sports for fun or emotionally, they do so for profit alone.

Edited by Brizzer - 26 Feb 2020 at 18:23
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Bigmal Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 26 Feb 2020 at 18:35
You are spot on with final sentence so I must conclude that CVC will attempt to "sweat" its asset(s) in rue PE style.

Problem is that International rugby followed in the N Hemisphere by Champions Cup remain the big draws ( later rounds in the case of the CC). The Prem does attract
decent crows particularly for local derbies but is the standard good enough?

Having watched a run of poor or one sided games the cost ( to a casual supporter) of £30-60 is probably too much.

Given the issues that have emerged of late ( financial problems with the RFU and SRFU) I'm not holding my breath.

As a mater of interest how financially sound are the Welsh,Irish,french and Italian Unions?
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote stadium Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 27 Feb 2020 at 08:44
The Premiership has been poor value this year to many one sided games Exeter v Northampton for example. With the Saracens fiasco and the England World Cup hangover the season seems to be dead already. The RFU did not help with its timing of the announcement that it wants to kill off the Championship. All in All the games future is at stake. 
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Stalwart Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 27 Feb 2020 at 10:13
Originally posted by stadium stadium wrote:

The Premiership has been poor value this year to many one sided games Exeter v Northampton for example. With the Saracens fiasco and the England World Cup hangover the season seems to be dead already. The RFU did not help with its timing of the announcement that it wants to kill off the Championship. All in All the games future is at stake. 

If they get their way, and we get ring fencing, every season will produce a lot of meaningless games.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Pappashanga Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 27 Feb 2020 at 10:35
Having watched a fair number of SANZAR matches, which are of a high standard, I consider international club rugby is not a bad idea. It IS highly commercialised. Money talks and it's idle to pretend it doesn't.
However the players have to come from somewhere, and penny pinching at lower levels is very shortsighted.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Brizzer Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 27 Feb 2020 at 10:52
So how would a club WC look? 2 clubs each from NZ, Aus, SA, Eng, Fra, Wal, Ire & Sco? I'm not so sure that any other leagues would be strong enough, maybe Italy. That would give 16 clubs, I should imagine in pools of 4 with the winners making up the semi's. Or would they use the European Cup as a qualification tournament?
Quite like the idea of the tournament in principal....when will they be able to fit it in?
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Camquin Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 27 Feb 2020 at 11:20
More likely four each from England, France, Pro14 and Super rugby so there is actual competition for places.



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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Pappashanga Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 27 Feb 2020 at 11:54
Initial competition within each country then quarter finals etc between the top teams. A point system that favours try scoring. Good idea to examine how Super rugby does it. They have an Argentinean club and a Japanese one in addition to SA NZ and Australia.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Richard Lowther Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 27 Feb 2020 at 11:58
CVC are in it to make money and the game at the top level will change in order to allow the CVC a return on their investment. 

Ticket prices will rise, broadcasting deals will grow and you will see the end of (most?) 6 Nations games on free to air TV; new tournaments will be created playing in venues willing to pay high prices to host them. 


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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Pappashanga Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 27 Feb 2020 at 12:38
Free to air will be a thing of the past, like cricket. 
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote cheshire exile Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 27 Feb 2020 at 13:16
An opportunity for the Championship on free to air then? 
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote billesleyexile Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 27 Feb 2020 at 13:42
Originally posted by cheshire exile cheshire exile wrote:

An opportunity for the Championship on free to air then? 

Almost certainly not, because as with RL, this will just herald the top tier pulling even further away, and lead to a further collapse in interest in the lower tiers. For this to work would take massive investment, and at the top level that means ringfencing, franchising or both, because otherwise no one would be daft enough to spend the money.

The future is probably going to be not unlike the NRL, with multiple feeder clubs for each franchise. There will be interest in watching the feeders, but it will be open and clear that that's what they are. F1 is still trying to recover from its experience with CVC by the way.

In some ways we're going back to the old amateur days - a recognised top tier, with a closed fixture list, and everyone else a junior club that knows their place and asks "how high?" when told by a "senior" club to jump.

Welcome to 1970.


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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Camquin Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 27 Feb 2020 at 13:57
I think we will see an awful lot of things don "for the fans" by which of course they do nto mean "fans" like us but any random bye-blow who can be persuaded to part with money in exchange for something that may or may not be sport.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Brizzer Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 27 Feb 2020 at 14:39
I think that we could certainly see the birth of a 'super league' with franchised clubs. We already have these in place across the UK with the exception of England. The clubs then feed into the franchise as already stated.

I can see pro's on the one hand, but lots and lots of cons on the other.
If you invite big money into your sport, then the big money will want to take over and get big returns regardless of how they do it.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote The Perfect Ten Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 27 Feb 2020 at 14:56
I can't see any French club giving up on the Top 14 any time soon. For most of them winning that appears to be more important than winning the Champions Cup.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Raider999 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 27 Feb 2020 at 15:01
Originally posted by stadium stadium wrote:

The Premiership has been poor value this year to many one sided games Exeter v Northampton for example. With the Saracens fiasco and the England World Cup hangover the season seems to be dead already. The RFU did not help with its timing of the announcement that it wants to kill off the Championship. All in All the games future is at stake. 


Agreed, also this is what will happen when the Premiership is ring-fenced. If you are in the bottom 3 or 4 after halfway there will be no incentive to either field best teams or give 100%.

Interest will be lost, attendances will fall and eventually players will be paid less.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (1) Thanks(1)   Quote Penda Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 27 Feb 2020 at 17:22
The RFU should drastically cut the money it puts into the Premiership. £70m I believe, goes into professional rugby from the RFU. Why should the community game lose money to effectively subsidise the profits of the likes of CVC? 

If the PRL wants to get into bed with commercial parasites like CVC let it. But not at the expense of the rest of the game.

You only have to look at what CVC did to Formula 1. There isn't a long enough bargepole.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Stalwart Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 27 Feb 2020 at 17:46
Originally posted by Penda Penda wrote:

The RFU should drastically cut the money it puts into the Premiership. £70m I believe, goes into professional rugby from the RFU. Why should the community game lose money to effectively subsidise the profits of the likes of CVC? 

If the PRL wants to get into bed with commercial parasites like CVC let it. But not at the expense of the rest of the game.

You only have to look at what CVC did to Formula 1. There isn't a long enough bargepole.

Well said, spot on. The RFU have completely lost touch with what they are there for.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Pirate Pig Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 27 Feb 2020 at 17:59
I  think a world league is a long way off mainly due to the difficulties in agreeing a suitable playing season.
I can see a European league happening in the short term with the winners of that league playing the winners of the Super 15 in a world club championship.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote gerg_861 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 27 Feb 2020 at 20:05
Oddly enough, I wonder if the CVC wont accidentally level the playing field . After the initial infusion is p*ssed away, then the prem clubs will all get 30%less per year. CVC says that they will grow revenues, but investors want return on investment.
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