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NL1: Signings, Retentions and Departures 2020-21
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kingsheathlad View Drop Down
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Originally posted by TigerTitan TigerTitan wrote:

wear are cambridge getting all their money for these big signings? they had a go fund me page about 3 months ago stating they were about to go under due to covid!!! 

i hope that fund wasnt actually used to recruit new players 

I reckon most clubs need help in these difficult times. Early renewal of memberships, donations, player sponsorships etc. Not all clubs will disclose their financial position. 
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Camquin View Drop Down
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I am not on the committee and have no knowledge of individual player contracts.
But I believe the signings are on match fee contracts - no matches no fees.
I understand there was a cash flow problem releated to a late payment of grant funding, but this has been resolved.
However,  with no games and little use of facilities I suspect all clubs are short of funds.
But cambridge at least use the club house for the 16-18 Academy so will get paid for educating those boys. (I would love us to have a girls academy team but that will be a while would need a large enough group to want to start).
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Points: 3320 		Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Rabbie Burns Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 25 Aug 2020 at 20:19
I think there is a lot of changes to contracts this year at most clubs, the ones that offer jobs alongside must be struggling as well with most business still in furlough or working from home
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Rabbie 

It's very interesting!

Four months ago Cambridge had a massive funding issue. I quote their chairman " With the sudden collapse in our income we now find ourselves in need of financial support. Having scrutinized our finances for the next 3 months, the Committee assess that we need £40,000 to see us through this crisis." That was in April.They have raised £14k according to the page or 35% of what was needed!
They now have probably signed more players than any other club and that must be at a cost, no matter what way you look at it!  You have several players that have publicly said they have moved to the area just to play for Cambridge, the young back rower from Rotherham with his family for one!

Moseley had the same problem, no money, no income, set up a go fund me page to raise funds, think they pulled in about £18k and then sign Ashley Johnson and several others, at what cost!

Then we have Chinnor, who had a Chairman that wanted a cut in the salary cap to £150k, plastered it all over TRP as well as this site. Didn't get their way so along comes Tonga'uiha and Armitage!

Very strange to say the least! 

I don't think we start till Jan at best, if at all, let's see who is still standing then! Because on the face of it, there seems to be some big money being thrown about for people to play touch rugby twice a week!


Edited by Scrumtime - 27 Aug 2020 at 07:39
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kingsheathlad View Drop Down
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[QUOTE=Scrumtime]
Rabbie 

It's very interesting!

Four months ago Cambridge had a massive funding issue. I quote their chairman " With the sudden collapse in our income we now find ourselves in need of financial support. Having scrutinized our finances for the next 3 months, the Committee assess that we need £40,000 to see us through this crisis." That was in April.They have raised £14k according to the page or 35% of what was needed!
They now have probably signed more players than any other club and that must be at a cost, no matter what way you look at it!  You have several players that have publicly said they have moved to the area just to play for Cambridge, the young back rower from Rotherham with his family for one!

Moseley had the same problem, no money, no income, set up a go fund me page to raise funds, think they pulled in about £18k and then sign Ashley Johnson and several others, at what cost!

Then we have Chinnor, who had a Chairman that wanted a cut in the salary cap to £150k, plastered it all over TRP as well as this site. Didn't get their way so along comes Tonga'uiha and Armitage!

Very strange to say the least! 

I don't think we start till Jan at best, if at all, let's see who is still standing then! Because on the face of it, there seems to be some big money being thrown about for people to play touch rugby twice a week!
How do know Moseley players were signed. They may not be on contracts but paid per game
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Sid James View Drop Down
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Originally posted by Scrumtime Scrumtime wrote:

Rabbie 
It's very interesting!
Four months ago Cambridge had a massive funding issue. I quote their chairman " With the sudden collapse in our income we now find ourselves in need of financial support. Having scrutinized our finances for the next 3 months, the Committee assess that we need £40,000 to see us through this crisis." That was in April.They have raised £14k according to the page or 35% of what was needed!
They now have probably signed more players than any other club and that must be at a cost, no matter what way you look at it!  You have several players that have publicly said they have moved to the area just to play for Cambridge, the young back rower from Rotherham with his family for one!
Moseley had the same problem, no money, no income, set up a go fund me page to raise funds, think they pulled in about £18k and then sign Ashley Johnson and several others, at what cost!
Then we have Chinnor, who had a Chairman that wanted a cut in the salary cap to £150k, plastered it all over TRP as well as this site. Didn't get their way so along comes Tonga'uiha and Armitage!
Very strange to say the least! 
I don't think we start till Jan at best, if at all, let's see who is still standing then! Because on the face of it, there seems to be some big money being thrown about for people to play touch rugby twice a week!
 
Talking below level 2, there are many variables to consider when a player has moved clubs but I agree that the majority move for financial reasons. 
Any Club paying retainers during this period of extraodinary circumstances are really desperate and not acting in the interests of their Club members. They should be having a good look at themselves and be asking why, asa Rugby Club, they cannot hang on to players without their being a financial incentive.
I accept that with some players, there may be a signing-on fee rather than a retainer but with those players there would have been whenever they signed. If the Club can afford to do that during these times, good luck to them but again, are you best serving your Club by doing this at a time of uncertainty reagrding rugby?
I suspect that most players who have moved Clubs during this close-down have agreed contracts that are based on appearance money. The agreed appearance money (whenever that starts!) will probably be more than they were to receive at their previous club or, the player may have simply moved to better his level of rugby.
Therefore, I suspect that the majority of signings and movements by players should be costing the recipient Club nothing until we start playing rugby.
Some Clubs may be hoping for a change in fortune prior to Jan 2021. Good luck with that.
 
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Sid James View Drop Down
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Originally posted by kingsheathlad kingsheathlad wrote:

[QUOTE=Scrumtime]
 
How do know Moseley players were signed. They may not be on contracts but paid per game
 
Kingsheathlad,
 
I sincerely hope that no Club is paying players on a 'paid per game' basis without those players having signed a contract. Such a Club would be in deep s--t if found out.
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Originally posted by Sid James Sid James wrote:

Originally posted by kingsheathlad kingsheathlad wrote:

[QUOTE=Scrumtime]
 
How do know Moseley players were signed. They may not be on contracts but paid per game
 
Kingsheathlad,
 
I sincerely hope that no Club is paying players on a 'paid per game' basis without those players having signed a contract. Such a Club would be in deep s--t if found out.

You absolutely 100% have to sign a contract and it has to be registered with the RFU to receive ANY financial remuneration at all. It doesn't matter whether a player is on a monthly salary or is on a much more sensible pay to play deal. Contracts are obligatory and if players are receiving money or any other financial benefit without one, the club are in a very serious breach of RFU regulations, never mind HMRC.
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Originally posted by kingsheathlad kingsheathlad wrote:

How do know Moseley players were signed. They may not be on contracts but paid per game

Quite apart from anything else, the GoFundMe page (and additional donations direct to the club) was/is quite literally a squadbuilder fund, not a keep the lights on fund. It was/is communicated entirely in terms of building the team, not keeping the lights on. So, "club raises money to spend on players then signs players" might not necessarily be the story some seem to think it is. It was *never* a "save Moseley" fund, and was always a "help us sign more players" fund. As a contributor, I'm glad to have helped.




Edited by billesleyexile - 27 Aug 2020 at 09:36
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according to my nephews friend who plays sevens with a player who used to play for blood and sand. cambridge overspent by abotu 40,000 last year and were in a bit of trouble and used gofundme to cover up this hole. however big new signings not getting paid until season starts. just expenses money etc. £20 notes handed out to cover petrol after training which is fair enough. 
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kingsheathlad View Drop Down
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I have no knowledge of how Moseley signings work. My response above was to 'scrumtime' s' assumption on the clubs position. 
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In all fairness to you, I think it's pretty obvious that when you said 'paid per game, not on a contract' you meant 'not on a salary'.

Edited by Mark W-J - 27 Aug 2020 at 14:24
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Originally posted by Mark W-J Mark W-J wrote:

In all fairness to you, I think it's pretty obvious that when you said 'paid per game, not on a contract' you meant 'not on a salary'.

Exactly
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Originally posted by Mark W-J Mark W-J wrote:

In all fairness to you, I think it's pretty obvious that when you said 'paid per game, not on a contract' you meant 'not on a salary'.

It depends on the paid per game, 

is it paid per appearance in said game or paid for the game the club has participated in or paid for the game the club should of participated in... 

it is open to interpretation, this is where the issue lies with no formal contract to outline the players and clubs obligations


Edited by front5 - 27 Aug 2020 at 19:46
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Just to emphasise the point - you HAVE to sign and register a contract with the RFU if ANY form or system of payment or remuneration is to be given. HMRC have to be informed also. That includes travelling expenses, match fees, signing bonuses etc - absolutely everything. Handing out £20 notes after training would be very dodgy. It actually protects both the player and the club to have everything written down and agreed upon. The vast majority of National League clubs now conform to this standard, but there are a few that still do it the wrong way. Eventually they will come unstuck - as several already have.
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Originally posted by TigerTitan TigerTitan wrote:

according to my nephews friend who plays sevens with a player who used to play for blood and sand. cambridge overspent by abotu 40,000 last year and were in a bit of trouble and used gofundme to cover up this hole. however big new signings not getting paid until season starts. just expenses money etc. £20 notes handed out to cover petrol after training which is fair enough. 


Is this the nephew who feeds you so much of the incorrect information you post on here?

Or do you have more than one nephew wishing his mum and dad were from one-parent families?
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Originally posted by WEvans WEvans wrote:

Originally posted by TigerTitan TigerTitan wrote:

according to my nephews friend who plays sevens with a player who used to play for blood and sand. cambridge overspent by abotu 40,000 last year and were in a bit of trouble and used gofundme to cover up this hole. however big new signings not getting paid until season starts. just expenses money etc. £20 notes handed out to cover petrol after training which is fair enough. 



Is this the nephew who feeds you so much of the incorrect information you post on here?

Or do you have more than one nephew wishing his mum and dad were from one-parent families?
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According to Ruck.co.uk Ashley Johnson to rejoin wasps on a short term deal
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They spent the "Go Fund The Team" money already?

Hope they get a decent loan fee for him! 
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Originally posted by TigerTitan TigerTitan wrote:

according to my nephews friend who plays sevens with a player who used to play for blood and sand. cambridge overspent by abotu 40,000 last year and were in a bit of trouble and used gofundme to cover up this hole. however big new signings not getting paid until season starts. just expenses money etc. £20 notes handed out to cover petrol after training which is fair enough. 


 
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