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isleonian View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote isleonian Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Topic: European Super League
    Posted: 24 Apr 2021 at 17:09
kempstonblue moenie worrie nie
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote kempstonblue Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 24 Apr 2021 at 16:54
I was panicking when I saw the title. Had a desperate RFU decided a competition with The Championship, France D2,  Scotland Super 6? Italy Top 10

Edited by kempstonblue - 24 Apr 2021 at 16:57
The older I get, the more the RFU leave me confused.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Mark W-J Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 22 Apr 2021 at 13:36
Originally posted by isleonian isleonian wrote:

European Super Rugby Union league of 12, proposed composition by country:
England - 1
Ireland  - 3
Scotland- 1
Wales     - 0
Italy       - 0
France    - 7 


Entry-level trolling at best.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote gerg_861 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 22 Apr 2021 at 12:09
Originally posted by Brizzer Brizzer wrote:

Originally posted by Steve@Mose Steve@Mose wrote:

Originally posted by Brizzer Brizzer wrote:

Originally posted by gerg_861 gerg_861 wrote:

Originally posted by WEvans WEvans wrote:

Originally posted by Steve@Mose Steve@Mose wrote:

Darren Childs steps down as Premiership chief after less than two years in charge

Quote
The 55-year-old, who will leave his post in "the coming weeks", will act as an advisor to CVC Capital Partners, a key investor in the Premiership, Pro14 and Six Nations.

Childs' predecessor as Premiership chief Mark McCafferty took on a similar role after departing from the English top flight.


Jobs/rewards for the boys.

They could almost be MPs.

I'd assume that it is CVC letting him save face/buying him off so that they can get someone better in.

Gerg, I doubt that CVC do either of those things.
As they are employing him it will be for a reason. If they wanted him out he would have left very quickly, by the back door, taxi waiting, personal effects to follow in a cardboard box.


What better than to buy the services of someone familiar with the companies you are doing business with, and who has an awareness of the business' respective vulnerabilities/pressure points that can help steer negotiations to a successful outcome.


Exactly.

I respectfully disagree. Removing a C-level executive isn't like removing a standard employee. Darren Childs was CVC's appointment, if he was straight out fired, then that looks bad on CVC. Saying he will 'consult' helps them save face. But don't take my word, the Egg Chasers guys have made the point more eloquently in this video. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xaQWXjDm120 
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote isleonian Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 22 Apr 2021 at 12:06
European Super Rugby Union league of 12, proposed composition by country:
England - 1
Ireland  - 3
Scotland- 1
Wales     - 0
Italy       - 0
France    - 7 

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Brizzer Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 22 Apr 2021 at 11:53
Originally posted by Steve@Mose Steve@Mose wrote:

Originally posted by Brizzer Brizzer wrote:

Originally posted by gerg_861 gerg_861 wrote:

Originally posted by WEvans WEvans wrote:

Originally posted by Steve@Mose Steve@Mose wrote:

Darren Childs steps down as Premiership chief after less than two years in charge

Quote
The 55-year-old, who will leave his post in "the coming weeks", will act as an advisor to CVC Capital Partners, a key investor in the Premiership, Pro14 and Six Nations.

Childs' predecessor as Premiership chief Mark McCafferty took on a similar role after departing from the English top flight.


Jobs/rewards for the boys.

They could almost be MPs.

I'd assume that it is CVC letting him save face/buying him off so that they can get someone better in.

Gerg, I doubt that CVC do either of those things.
As they are employing him it will be for a reason. If they wanted him out he would have left very quickly, by the back door, taxi waiting, personal effects to follow in a cardboard box.


What better than to buy the services of someone familiar with the companies you are doing business with, and who has an awareness of the business' respective vulnerabilities/pressure points that can help steer negotiations to a successful outcome.


Exactly.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Steve@Mose Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 21 Apr 2021 at 17:31
Originally posted by Brizzer Brizzer wrote:

Originally posted by gerg_861 gerg_861 wrote:

Originally posted by WEvans WEvans wrote:

Originally posted by Steve@Mose Steve@Mose wrote:

Darren Childs steps down as Premiership chief after less than two years in charge

Quote
The 55-year-old, who will leave his post in "the coming weeks", will act as an advisor to CVC Capital Partners, a key investor in the Premiership, Pro14 and Six Nations.

Childs' predecessor as Premiership chief Mark McCafferty took on a similar role after departing from the English top flight.


Jobs/rewards for the boys.

They could almost be MPs.

I'd assume that it is CVC letting him save face/buying him off so that they can get someone better in.

Gerg, I doubt that CVC do either of those things.
As they are employing him it will be for a reason. If they wanted him out he would have left very quickly, by the back door, taxi waiting, personal effects to follow in a cardboard box.

What better than to buy the services of someone familiar with the companies you are doing business with, and who has an awareness of the business' respective vulnerabilities/pressure points that can help steer negotiations to a successful outcome.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Camquin Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 21 Apr 2021 at 17:06
Brizzer - that does seem to be the American way and CVC are based in New York - being a spin out from Citibank.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote front5 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 21 Apr 2021 at 16:45
Originally posted by SKalpy SKalpy wrote:

A have never heard a team from the Boarders - Jedburgh Hawick etc saying Edinburgh Glasgow are getting a leg up? Its easy if they move to a Super league they are no longer in domestic leagues 

Not been around rugby very long then front5, don't you remember the Border Reevers

I am agreeing they are not complaining about it just let them go is my point
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Brizzer Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 21 Apr 2021 at 16:38
Originally posted by gerg_861 gerg_861 wrote:

Originally posted by WEvans WEvans wrote:

Originally posted by Steve@Mose Steve@Mose wrote:

Darren Childs steps down as Premiership chief after less than two years in charge

Quote
The 55-year-old, who will leave his post in "the coming weeks", will act as an advisor to CVC Capital Partners, a key investor in the Premiership, Pro14 and Six Nations.

Childs' predecessor as Premiership chief Mark McCafferty took on a similar role after departing from the English top flight.


Jobs/rewards for the boys.

They could almost be MPs.

I'd assume that it is CVC letting him save face/buying him off so that they can get someone better in.

Gerg, I doubt that CVC do either of those things.
As they are employing him it will be for a reason. If they wanted him out he would have left very quickly, by the back door, taxi waiting, personal effects to follow in a cardboard box.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote gerg_861 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 21 Apr 2021 at 15:28
Originally posted by WEvans WEvans wrote:

Originally posted by Steve@Mose Steve@Mose wrote:

Darren Childs steps down as Premiership chief after less than two years in charge

Quote
The 55-year-old, who will leave his post in "the coming weeks", will act as an advisor to CVC Capital Partners, a key investor in the Premiership, Pro14 and Six Nations.

Childs' predecessor as Premiership chief Mark McCafferty took on a similar role after departing from the English top flight.

Jobs/rewards for the boys.

They could almost be MPs.
I'd assume that it is CVC letting him save face/buying him off so that they can get someone better in.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote WEvans Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 21 Apr 2021 at 14:14
Originally posted by Steve@Mose Steve@Mose wrote:

Darren Childs steps down as Premiership chief after less than two years in charge

Quote
The 55-year-old, who will leave his post in "the coming weeks", will act as an advisor to CVC Capital Partners, a key investor in the Premiership, Pro14 and Six Nations.

Childs' predecessor as Premiership chief Mark McCafferty took on a similar role after departing from the English top flight.

Jobs/rewards for the boys.

They could almost be MPs.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Steve@Mose Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 21 Apr 2021 at 14:03
Darren Childs steps down as Premiership chief after less than two years in charge

Quote
The 55-year-old, who will leave his post in "the coming weeks", will act as an advisor to CVC Capital Partners, a key investor in the Premiership, Pro14 and Six Nations.

Childs' predecessor as Premiership chief Mark McCafferty took on a similar role after departing from the English top flight.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote islander Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 21 Apr 2021 at 12:22
Telegraph article today:

While European Super League row gets ugly, Premiership Rugby stays silent hoping nobody notices

If the Premiership is determined to force through expansion and ring-fencing, it must walk through fire to get there - just look at football

DANIEL SCHOFIELD
DEPUTY RUGBY UNION CORRESPONDENT
20 April 2021 • 2:06pm


In the unseemly rush to tap in the open goal of condemning the European Super League proposal – a scramble that included the Duke of Cambridge, Keir Starmer, James Corden and Dr Evil (probably) – there was nothing but silence from Premiership Rugby.

Indeed, an edict from head office went out on Tuesday effectively gagging executives from discussing the matter with the media. Right now Premiership Rugby is sitting in its delicate house of glass, desperately hoping none of the stone-wielding mob notices its presence as it storms the gates of Anfield and Old Trafford.

While the Super League is on an entirely different scale to the ring-fencing designs of many Premiership clubs, the accusations of rampant greed, trashing the integrity of the league and going against the wishes of the supporters will hit home as uncomfortably as a massage with a sea urchin. To be clear, the R-word has yet to be implemented. Relegation is suspended this season while a two-legged Championship play-off final will determine who becomes the Premiership’s 13th team next season, most likely Saracens.

In a year in which clubs have made losses of around £10 million because of the pandemic, this was understandable, however the fear remains that this was always a Trojan horse towards the end of relegation. Once you have 13 teams then you might as well have 14 as you do not need any extra weekends to accommodate them. And once you have the 14th team, if they cough up an entrance fee, then you can quietly pull up the drawbridge for an arbitrary period.

One proposal on the table is to suspend relegation until the 2024-25 season. This would have to be signed off by the RFU Council, which is a very different beast to the one a few years ago that considered ring-fencing anathema. The quiet confidence among some – but not all – Premiership clubs that the RFU Council would come on board may need to be reevaluated in the wake of the universal opprobrium that the European Super League has attracted.

Clearly the prize for the top-flight clubs is more matches and more stability. The present system of one team falling down and bouncing back straight away means the Premiership was already a de facto 13-team league. The last team to break that stranglehold was London Welsh and look at them now.

But if there is one lesson you can draw from recent rugby history it should be: tamper with competition structures at your peril. The prime example is Super Rugby. At the turn of the century it was the sport’s golden goose, continuously laying shining eggs. Yet its stakeholders could not resist fattening it up, increasing it from 12 teams to 14, then 15 and ultimately 18 teams in an unwieldy conference system at which point the goose collapsed under its own bloated weight.

Similarly the Pro 14, soon to be Pro 16 with four South African teams, already looks like heading down the same messy path.

The Premiership’s great selling point was always its competitive tension to the backdrop of raucous atmospheres, that every game mattered throughout the season. Remove relegation and you lose its USP. You only have to look at Worcester Warriors’ recent results – conceding 159 points in their past three games – to see what happens when you remove the peril of walking close to the trapdoor. What motivates the casual fan to turn up or tune in to another 50-point drubbing?

It is too soon to say whether the backlash to Super League proposals will cause Premiership clubs to change course. But if they are truly determined to force through expansion and ring-fencing, then they will have to walk through fire to get there.




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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote donnyladinsheffield Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 21 Apr 2021 at 12:20
I am afraid I have to agree.  Proposals to ring fence have been made before and are tangible and the widespread condemnation that came with the ESL was conspicuous by abscence.  Indeed you would find as many if not more articles in favour as against (this forum being a notable exception).

Maybe ESL will have done us a favour and make people 'think again', especially those who advocate but I doubt it.  Indeed it could mean they feel empowered to proceed knowing that it has not generated the furore ESL did.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Rob C Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 21 Apr 2021 at 10:59
Originally posted by No 7 No 7 wrote:

The collapse of the football European super league proposal is huge for rugby and the move to ring fence the premiership. The level of opposition was incredible and forced a withdrawal. 

Hopefully this will be recognised in rugby by the governing body.

I fear the difference will be that the premiership fans will be all for ring fencing and the government won't give a stuff...
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote No 7 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 21 Apr 2021 at 06:40
The collapse of the football European super league proposal is huge for rugby and the move to ring fence the premiership. The level of opposition was incredible and forced a withdrawal. 

Hopefully this will be recognised in rugby by the governing body.
Ambition should be made of sterner stuff.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Steve@Mose Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 20 Apr 2021 at 23:43
An Irish Times article from June 2020.  Premiership ringfencing is undoubtedly one part of CVC's grand plan.

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Raider999 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 20 Apr 2021 at 20:11
Originally posted by Richard Lowther Richard Lowther wrote:

Originally posted by Raider999 Raider999 wrote:

Have I missed something?

Has this forum now become a football one? Or has someone suggested a ESL for rugby?


You are missing the arguments been put forward by the opponents of the European Super League that football is a meritious game, where on field success through promotion (and relegation) is fundamental.

Those same arguments apply in Rugby and should be used to stave off any threat of a Premiership closed shop of the biggest and richest clubs. 


I see and totally agree - never been a fan of any type of ring-fencing.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote CJB1 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 20 Apr 2021 at 19:59
Originally posted by Dotcom Dotcom wrote:

Originally posted by Pirate Pig Pirate Pig wrote:

After a meeting with clubs and officials of those not involved with the Super League "Downing Street said the prime minister told his meeting with FA and Premier League officials that the government "will not stand by while a small handful of owners create a closed shop".
I hope the government take the same robust action against PRL.

We should all wriite or e-mail our MPs to ask that the Govt take the same action with any RFU/Premiership ringfencing proposals
You'd have to convince my MP that there was a Kashmiri angle to it or he'd not be interested.
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