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OEs withdraw from Nat1

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Scrumtime View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Scrumtime Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 10 Aug 2021 at 11:49
Originally posted by workerbee workerbee wrote:

OE's first XV is a limited company and as such lodges the annual accounts with Companies house for all the see and it is very clear by their 19/20 accounts they were in trouble.

Im sorry to say just a quick shirt through other clubs in National 1 don't paint a pretty picture.
I think the RFU needs to do some proper digging on the whole lot. OEs could just be the first of many I feel.

Blackheath's balance sheet reads  .. - £480 k. that's £60k worse off that Oes .. wonder if the RFU has a closer look at them?

Cambridge chairman posted on their web site this time last year they were £40 k away from being bust, yet they only pulled £20k of that in on their crowd funder
They also managed to sign 15 players ( 8 of which were for the 20/21 season that never happened)in the course of the last year and claimed Furlough for many.. how they got away with that?

Leeds had the £800k CVA reduced to £80k and wrote off £720 k of debit 

Chinnor have all their eggs in one basket, what happens if Rectory homes go?

There are many in National 1 that have problems, time for either the RFU to act now or start to filter some CVC money down. You cannot expect to play National 1 rugby as a club and get no funding. I seem to recall it was £125 k less than 5 years ago, its now nothing. In Div 1 football (level 3) in 19/20 season the average for each club was £1.35m...that was without TV money!


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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Thatbloke Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 10 Aug 2021 at 10:59
Enough said - Previous comments by various posters fully justified
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote workerbee Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 10 Aug 2021 at 10:56
OE's first XV is a limited company and as such lodges the annual accounts with Companies house for all the see and it is very clear by their 19/20 accounts they were in trouble.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote castleparknight Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 10 Aug 2021 at 08:26
You lost for words Rothman2? You have some quality players joining you from Donny, and I fully intend to pop on over whenever the fixture list - if this matter had been addressed sooner your Team would no doubt still be in Nat 1 (which is a glorious league in my opinion) and we could be hoping for a return to our derby matches.....maybe two years time when you bounce back.
Onward and Upwards C'mon Donny!
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Rothman2 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 09 Aug 2021 at 21:08
.

Edited by Rothman2 - 10 Aug 2021 at 08:14
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Rothman2 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 09 Aug 2021 at 21:02
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Edited by Rothman2 - 10 Aug 2021 at 08:14
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Raider999 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 09 Aug 2021 at 20:37
Originally posted by Rothman2 Rothman2 wrote:

That’s the point though Raider. They didn’t finish. 
Promotion has to be earned and the second placed teams would normally have played each other in a play off, but they didn’t finish the season either.
Rotherham were shoddily handled but on that there has been no change for more than 20 years.
Make rules up as they go along. Great game, shoddily managed. Look how they have handled the Championship? And I mean handled in the loosest possible terms.
They arranged a 10 game mini league specifically to promote Saracens and everyone is ok with it. 

All that matters is England and the Prem. 

To me all that matters is club Rugby and they have effectively destroyed it below the Prem. Record crowds at the EFL this weekend and the game of Rugby is on its knees, and you know what they have what they deserve and I will never forgive them for the way they handled the situation with Roth.





Record crowds at EFL this week - probably due to the fact Premier League doesn't start until 13th August.

I am fully aware that the league didn't finish, but I don't see any other club's supporters bleating about it.

Fully agree with you over the farce of Championship playing a few games just so the cheats could be promoted - I wonder what they would have done if the other teams had followed L Scottish example and not played, there again the answer is obvious - promote the cheats by default.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Rothman2 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 09 Aug 2021 at 20:31
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Edited by Rothman2 - 10 Aug 2021 at 08:13
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Thatbloke Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 09 Aug 2021 at 18:53
I'm not sure how much we can rely on a posting from another club's website but if true then surely the deadline imposed by the RFU should have been the date where it would still be possible to rejig the Leagues as necessary ie Roth being reinstated to Nat1. 
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Halliford Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 09 Aug 2021 at 18:46
Just seen this on the Rosslyn Park website:

"It appears that the final nail in their coffin was an ultimatum from the RFU, who had been working with the club to try to salvage the situation. The club had consistently assured the RFU over a long period that they had another major sponsor in the offing. However, the RFU became increasingly concerned that the club would be unable to meet its financial commitments and imposed a deadline last week by which the club was required to provide a written assurance that they would be able to meet those commitments. It failed to do so."
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (1) Thanks(1)   Quote Camquin Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 09 Aug 2021 at 17:17
Had OEs withdrawn before 1st June, Rotherham would have been reinstated and so on down the pyramid.

As it is, National 1 carries on with 15 sides.
All clubs lose approximately one fifteenth of their revenue, possibly less, as OEs did not have a lot of travelling support - except Moseley, who were due to play them at home in the pre-Christmas match and so lose a very lucrative fixture. I was surprised they were not playing Blackheath for that one.

While this is offset somewhat by reduced match fees - the income from a home match should cover two sets of match fees, travel and make a contribution to fixed costs. So I expect all sides to be out of pocket, Moseley more so than most.

The players still expecting to play for OEs have not had a chance to find other clubs. Players at the other 15 clubs will lose two sets of match fees.

Obviously, I do not have visibility of the goings-on at OEs. It could be that on May 31st, they honestly thought they had a new sponsor lined up, and believed they could finance a season. Then by July 1 it fell through, and they started talking to RFU finance.

I wonder if it would be possible to arrange a Barbarians fixture for Moseley?

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Raider999 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 09 Aug 2021 at 16:00
Originally posted by front5 front5 wrote:

I think its fair to say the majority if not all, are dismayed and annoyed/upset by some poor management. I feel for Rotherham as they are the ones who are the most hit. 

Agreed some clubs may have purchased train tickets etc, however if they have done so on a non-refundable basis taking into account the last year. I must say I think this is again poor management and would only say it is their own fault. 

It seemed on the face of it OE's were a community/family club and from their website it seems this decision as much as it has had the above effect will not effect the community rugby element of the club. I think we should all be able to have some credit towards OE's for this as ultimately the number one outcome should be always be the rugby; if kids, juniors, colts etc are being looked after, despite the sacrifice of the first team I am all for it. 

However I am still of the opinion they should start from the bottom of the pyramid from next year. 


Rotherham finished in the bottom 3 and were relegated - end of.

OEs National League side was bankrolled by 1 benefactor who unfortunately died. Without his money they would not have attracted the calibration of player who got them promoted through the leagues to Nat 1.

No sympathy for them at all. However I hope the rest of the club survives and the OE name continues at whatever level their highest remaking 15 currently play at.

There is no way they should start at N1 or even N2 level.

Other clubs have disappeared down the pyramid over the years and have worked (Richmond) or are working (London Welsh, East Grinstead, Haywards Heath) their way back up - treating OEs any different could open up the possibility of legal action from those clubs or others.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote WEvans Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 09 Aug 2021 at 12:23
Originally posted by Thatbloke Thatbloke wrote:

OK I'm going to be harsh here but
1) Yes it WAS inevitable a year ago
2) If you rely on 1 sugar-daddy then the end is inevitable - just a matter of time
3) Sounds like a fantastic club who should never have taken the path it did in the first place
Live and learn perhaps is the message here
Good luck OE's on starting afresh and rebuilding a club that is proud of itself and a shining light for the local community - hope it doesn't take too long

It wasn't inevitable a year ago. Likely maybe but not inevitable. An awful lot can happen in a year as we have all seen.

Plenty of clubs rely on a "sugar-daddy" and continue to exist year after year some even changing sugar-daddies along the way. Of course it isn't ideal but it happens.

Other clubs move from a "sugar-daddy" to a more sustainable ownership model. Yes their results tend to suffer in the short-term but they continue in the league. Some clubs have even chosen to field a team based on lower league players to fulfill fixtures even though it meant losing every game.

Quite simply it wasn't inevitable no matter how many times you might say it was.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote front5 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 08 Aug 2021 at 23:09
I think its fair to say the majority if not all, are dismayed and annoyed/upset by some poor management. I feel for Rotherham as they are the ones who are the most hit. 

Agreed some clubs may have purchased train tickets etc, however if they have done so on a non-refundable basis taking into account the last year. I must say I think this is again poor management and would only say it is their own fault. 

It seemed on the face of it OE's were a community/family club and from their website it seems this decision as much as it has had the above effect will not effect the community rugby element of the club. I think we should all be able to have some credit towards OE's for this as ultimately the number one outcome should be always be the rugby; if kids, juniors, colts etc are being looked after, despite the sacrifice of the first team I am all for it. 

However I am still of the opinion they should start from the bottom of the pyramid from next year. 
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Camquin Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 08 Aug 2021 at 21:05
The cut-off is June 1st.

The statement said they had been working with the RFU finance for the past  month.
Which would mean, starting in July.

I do think that all clubs should submit in May, a simple declaration that there is no reason why the club cannot complete the following season, signed by the officers.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote tigerburnie Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 08 Aug 2021 at 20:17
I thought the RFU had been involved, for how long before this announcement, who knows, are they also at fault with the lateness of this statement?
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Rabbie Burns Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 08 Aug 2021 at 16:42
There is a review as Rams fell foul of the beaks a couple of seasons ago
So many Christians not enough Lions
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Camquin Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 08 Aug 2021 at 14:51
I thought clubs had to submit a business plan for the season before the deadline for being replaced?
If this has gone by the wayside, perhaps it should be brought back.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Raider999 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 08 Aug 2021 at 14:05
Originally posted by FlyingRuck FlyingRuck wrote:

Surely they knew at least a year ago that they were facing this inevitability. Prior to the non-season 2020-21 they had already lost most of their players to other clubs and everyone knew the writing was on the wall. Except them apparently. Bailing out at such a late stage has denied another club the opportunity to play at level 3 and reduced the match-day revenues of the other 15 clubs. I think it stinks.


Agreed, their future was questioned on this forum but any problem was denied by officers of the club.

The writing was on the wall from the moment their sugar daddy unfortunately passed away.

As others have said they should continue at the level their next highest side is currently down to play at. There is no case for them being in N1 or N2 next season.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Robb Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 07 Aug 2021 at 20:35
Originally posted by kingsheathlad kingsheathlad wrote:

What I don't understand is leaving the announcement with less than a month away before season starts. One would of thought they would have known this position earlier in the summer which would have given opportunities to move relegated sides back up the leagues or is this too simplistic. 

Haywards Heath did it once the Thursday before the season started a few years ago. But any club that holds out this long knowing they cannot complete the season, thus blocking teams from being reprieved, is disgraceful 
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