National League Rugby Discussion Forum Homepage
Forum Home Forum Home > League Rugby - www.leaguerugby.co.uk > The Championship
  New Posts New Posts RSS Feed - Champ clubs reject Prem 2 franchise model
  FAQ FAQ  Forum Search   Events   Register Register  Login Login

IMPORTANT Remember to read the rules of the board and abide by them when posting.

Champ clubs reject Prem 2 franchise model
 Post Reply Post Reply Page  <1234>
Author
Message
  Topic Search Topic Search  Topic Options Topic Options
Yeeealing View Drop Down
First XV squad
First XV squad
Avatar

Joined: 24 Apr 2018
Location: Middlesex
Status: Offline
Points: 31 		Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Yeeealing Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 22 Nov 2023 at 22:57
Blues you seem to worry over Ealing quite a lot ? Just a observation 😂😂
Back to Top
Camquin View Drop Down
World Cup Winner
World Cup Winner
Avatar

Joined: 01 Jun 2007
Location: Cambridge
Status: Offline
Points: 11138 		Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Camquin Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 23 Nov 2023 at 00:47
Ealing is the best resourced side in the league, with the strongest squad and a fabulous facility.
Someone has to be.

Sweeney Delenda Est
Back to Top
WEvans View Drop Down
World Cup Winner
World Cup Winner


Joined: 08 Dec 2016
Location: London
Status: Offline
Points: 1369 		Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote WEvans Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 23 Nov 2023 at 17:12
Originally posted by FHLH FHLH wrote:

Originally posted by FHLH FHLH wrote:


With Sale's parlous state in National 1, I await their need for Sharks.

Having said that it will be interesting to see the Cambridge game against London Scottish who, I believe, fielded a number of loan players last season.

 Surely, loan players must undermine the members of the core squad unless you either don't have a core squad or genuinely don't have injury cover.

For a number read dozens! The LS squad last Friday featured ten Harlequins players. Not sure if they had any loan players from elsewhere.
Back to Top
Paul10 View Drop Down
World Cup Winner
World Cup Winner


Joined: 24 Mar 2023
Location: Milton Keynes
Status: Offline
Points: 540 		Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Paul10 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 24 Nov 2023 at 16:47
Some interesting comments on this here.
Back to Top
SK 88 View Drop Down
World Cup Winner
World Cup Winner


Joined: 08 Sep 2011
Location: Leicester
Status: Offline
Points: 575 		Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote SK 88 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 24 Nov 2023 at 18:38
Are there any plans in the public domain? Does the Championship have a proposal of its own? Can I read what the RFU's "Premiership 2" plan actually is anywhere?
Back to Top
FHLH View Drop Down
World Cup Winner
World Cup Winner
Avatar
Cambridge

Joined: 19 Apr 2009
Location: Cambridge
Status: Offline
Points: 5252 		Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote FHLH Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 24 Nov 2023 at 22:14
Originally posted by SK 88 SK 88 wrote:

Are there any plans in the public domain? Does the Championship have a proposal of its own? Can I read what the RFU's "Premiership 2" plan actually is anywhere?

Not that I can find, but 2 years ago:

Premiership Rugby has welcomed the vote, at a meeting today of the RFU Council, in favour of the expansion of the Gallagher Premiership to 14 clubs in season 2022-23, subject to meeting the required minimum standards.

The package of measures, which involves a temporary pause on relegation, will help to improve the financial stability and sustainability of professional rugby during the next three seasons following the unprecedented impact of COVID-19 on club finances.

The plan follows a detailed consultation involving stakeholders across the game, including Premiership Rugby and our member clubs, Championship clubs, The RPA, RFU Board and RFU Council.


How things change!
"My father told me big men fall just as quick as little ones, if you put a sword through their hearts."
Back to Top
Kimbo View Drop Down
World Cup Winner
World Cup Winner


Joined: 31 May 2007
Location: 'incleh
Status: Offline
Points: 6186 		Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Kimbo Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 25 Nov 2023 at 11:29
A fairly wide-ranging interview on the Beeb with Jon Sharp, Chairman of Cov RFC here: https://www.bbc.co.uk/sounds/play/p0gpv78b
It starts at about eight minutes in, then continues at around 22 (I think, maybe a little further on) minutes after a short break.
Covers a lot of ground around the Prem 2 debacle, the failed Prem clubs, and naturally the Cov club's outlook on the future of the game. Quite enlightening and worth a listen if you can spare the time.
His (paraphrased) quote re. "I wouldn't want to have to wash my mouth out with soap" particularly made me and 'er indoors giggle.
Our City,
Our Club
Back to Top
workerbee View Drop Down
World Cup Winner
World Cup Winner
Avatar

Joined: 20 May 2009
Location: Wirral
Status: Offline
Points: 883 		Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote workerbee Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 25 Nov 2023 at 12:27
Whilst there are no actual proposals in writing from the RFU or the Championship Most would agree that the starting point is 13 meaningful home games in a season. 
  • This would mean either a 14 teams league or a 12 team league league with a cup competition.
  • There are no proposals for a continuing Pre/ Championship cup. The problem would be how to fit it into a full Prem Season, mid week games would be difficult for semi pro Championship sides.
  • The Championship Cup has never taken off , clubs rest players and gates are low, the semi and final are almost a foregone conclusion so it just becomes pointless. 
  • The RFU have been unable to get any sponsorship for the League or cup and that is why they have been happy to give it over to the Championship to promote. 
  • The Prem 2 option (Which has not been Officially presented to the league or publicised) will only be attractive to aspirational clubs, so long as they maintain the entry levels into the Premiership. We will see what happens at the end of this season , will the play off go ahead if Ealing win?
  • Franchises will not work each will have to generate a fan base from Zero, unless you are Wasps, but again moving to a new area will again mean new Supporters. 
So finally going back to the start a 14 team league, 13 home games, No Cup would be my preferred option.
Back to Top
gerg_861 View Drop Down
World Cup Winner
World Cup Winner
Avatar

Joined: 11 Jun 2017
Location: Ealing
Status: Offline
Points: 2522 		Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote gerg_861 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 25 Nov 2023 at 13:40
Originally posted by Kimbo Kimbo wrote:

A fairly wide-ranging interview on the Beeb with Jon Sharp, Chairman of Cov RFC here: https://www.bbc.co.uk/sounds/play/p0gpv78b
It starts at about eight minutes in, then continues at around 22 (I think, maybe a little further on) minutes after a short break.
Covers a lot of ground around the Prem 2 debacle, the failed Prem clubs, and naturally the Cov club's outlook on the future of the game. Quite enlightening and worth a listen if you can spare the time.
His (paraphrased) quote re. "I wouldn't want to have to wash my mouth out with soap" particularly made me and 'er indoors giggle.
Great interview. Thanks for sharing.
Back to Top
TAS63 View Drop Down
British and Irish Lion
British and Irish Lion


Joined: 13 Apr 2009
Location: Bourne
Status: Offline
Points: 172 		Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote TAS63 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 04 Dec 2023 at 17:45
Bedford interview forum discussing Championship and future. Feels, to me, like an attempt to politely get the RFU to open up and be more discussive. Have to say they have more patience with them that I do - perhaps too much? But what choice do they really have.   https://youtube.com/watch?v=5tdvaxU1M0U&si=ZUBBOTAR3yPKhgNV ;
Back to Top
castleparknight View Drop Down
World Cup Winner
World Cup Winner
Avatar

Joined: 07 Jun 2012
Location: Doncaster
Status: Offline
Points: 2972 		Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote castleparknight Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 04 Dec 2023 at 20:38
The problems are many and varied- what have the RFU / PRL agreed behind closed doors? What does the RFU plan on doing with the Championship and then on down the pyramid.

What does the Championship want, and what are their plans if the RFU and them cannot come to a sensible agreement? I fear we won’t get answers, just lots a sketchy veiled references of we may do this or that. I think we (Rugby) are truly screwed until we get new leadership at HQ.
Onward and Upwards C'mon Donny!
Back to Top
FHLH View Drop Down
World Cup Winner
World Cup Winner
Avatar
Cambridge

Joined: 19 Apr 2009
Location: Cambridge
Status: Offline
Points: 5252 		Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote FHLH Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 05 Dec 2023 at 16:49
Slight divergence - will the England Central Contracts funding be top sliced from existing Premiership funding or will it be found elsewhere? Couldn't find anything obvious to clarify.
"My father told me big men fall just as quick as little ones, if you put a sword through their hearts."
Back to Top
Paul10 View Drop Down
World Cup Winner
World Cup Winner


Joined: 24 Mar 2023
Location: Milton Keynes
Status: Offline
Points: 540 		Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Paul10 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 05 Dec 2023 at 18:17
Originally posted by FHLH FHLH wrote:

Slight divergence - will the England Central Contracts funding be top sliced from existing Premiership funding or will it be found elsewhere? Couldn't find anything obvious to clarify.

I've only seen this mentioned in a theoretical way.

For example, Lawes suggested it would be good. (Of course he would)
I haven't seen or heard RFU suggesting this.

Though you'd expect the payments to clubs for international releases would be diverted to central contacts.
Back to Top
WILD BOAR View Drop Down
First XV squad
First XV squad


Joined: 06 Feb 2023
Location: GLOUCESTER
Status: Offline
Points: 51 		Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote WILD BOAR Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 06 Dec 2023 at 09:29
RFU Council Meeting Report 01/12/23

· Premiership 2. Has not been derailed. Expressions of interest currently been sourced. Clubs to be confirmed by June 2024. Size could be 10/12/14 teams. Launch 25-26 season.

Edited by WILD BOAR - 06 Dec 2023 at 09:46
Back to Top
islander View Drop Down
World Cup Winner
World Cup Winner


Joined: 17 Mar 2010
Location: jersey
Status: Online
Points: 7349 		Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote islander Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 06 Dec 2023 at 10:02
Originally posted by WILD BOAR WILD BOAR wrote:

RFU Council Meeting Report 01/12/23

· Premiership 2. Has not been derailed. Expressions of interest currently been sourced. Clubs to be confirmed by June 2024. Size could be 10/12/14 teams. Launch 25-26 season.

hmm - seems a bit like Monty Python's Black Knight "not being derailed" by losing his limbs one by one. There was a pretty clear expression of interest 2 weeks ago, wasn't there, with the current Champ clubs stating firmly that they weren't up for it? That may have been a negotiating position for much better terms, rather than a case of 'no, never under any circumstances', but still seems a very long way to go. At one stage clarity was due by December 2023, let's see if the new deadline 6 months hence is met...
Back to Top
Breakdown View Drop Down
First XV squad
First XV squad


Joined: 11 Apr 2023
Location: SW London
Status: Offline
Points: 59 		Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Breakdown Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 06 Dec 2023 at 10:39
If that is right, Wild Boar, it seems RFU and PRL are determined to steamroller ahead with a new Tier 2 not based on merit (i.e. Promotion/Relegation) but on suitability. That can only mean revival of the "Phoenix clubs" and trying to cherry pick NCA clubs that fit with their idea of creating a kind of zombie feeder league. e.g. DMP for the North East "franchise".

Who apart from PRL clubs and their failed former comrades actually benefits from the creation of such a league? 
Broken down. Beyond repair.
Back to Top
WILD BOAR View Drop Down
First XV squad
First XV squad


Joined: 06 Feb 2023
Location: GLOUCESTER
Status: Offline
Points: 51 		Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote WILD BOAR Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 06 Dec 2023 at 12:23
Spot on....Breakdown Thumbs Up
Back to Top
Greg View Drop Down
First XV regular
First XV regular


Joined: 30 Jan 2020
Location: Norfolk
Status: Offline
Points: 109 		Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Greg Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 06 Dec 2023 at 12:57
Surely in any negotiation both parties are required to put their proposition forward.
Why aren't the Championship making clear what they want/expect in the creation of a revised second tier? At the moment they only appear to say what they don't want - a position that simply gives all the decision-making back to the other party.
Bring in Mick Lynch for some training on how to hold the RFU/PRL to account.
Back to Top
castleparknight View Drop Down
World Cup Winner
World Cup Winner
Avatar

Joined: 07 Jun 2012
Location: Doncaster
Status: Offline
Points: 2972 		Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote castleparknight Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 06 Dec 2023 at 13:52
Originally posted by Greg Greg wrote:

Surely in any negotiation both parties are required to put their proposition forward.
Why aren't the Championship making clear what they want/expect in the creation of a revised second tier? At the moment they only appear to say what they don't want - a position that simply gives all the decision-making back to the other party.

Totally agree that Championship clubs need to be clear in what they want
Onward and Upwards C'mon Donny!
Back to Top
workerbee View Drop Down
World Cup Winner
World Cup Winner
Avatar

Joined: 20 May 2009
Location: Wirral
Status: Offline
Points: 883 		Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote workerbee Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 06 Dec 2023 at 14:30
I think the Championship clubs have made it clear what the want. 
  1. A level 2 league which is accessible to all clubs based on their ability and results in the lower leagues.
  2. Promotion and Relegation is sacrosanct.
  3. A meaningful league programme based on a 12/14 team format. 
They were unanimous at the last meeting that they did not want a franchise league , although this seems to be ignored by the RFU at the last Council meeting, when they inferred that there was no vote on the franchise model and it was still up for debate. They have now opted to go directly to those clubs involved and try to get them to agree to their model. I think the strategy is called "Divide and Rule" in the hope they will get enough of the Championship clubs will agree and then fill the spaces with franchise clubs. 

What I would say the main issue is that the RFU will not sit down with the championship directly and put their model in writing, which would allow the Championship to put their proposals to the RFU. 
Back to Top
 Post Reply Post Reply Page  <1234>
  Share Topic   

Forum Jump Forum Permissions View Drop Down

Forum Software by Web Wiz Forums® version 12.04
Copyright ©2001-2021 Web Wiz Ltd.