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Premiership II plans announced
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Kimbo View Drop Down
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Points: 6185 		Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Kimbo Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 19 Jan 2024 at 17:06
Originally posted by John Butler42 John Butler42 wrote:

Richard Lowther
In the words of the Panto season which I believe is still running '' oh no it doesn't'' !
Take no notice John. He's from that Yarksha.
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Originally posted by IainS IainS wrote:


There could have been another world in which, say, all teams in the Prem got equal funding, teams were required to have a capacity of 5,000/6,000, a realistic objective in many grounds if they use temporary stands, incremental improvements were required as you go up the tiers so clubs reaching the Championship will never be far off meeting Prem standards. Aspiration and investment would be encouraged, the league structure dynamic and exciting.


In the good old days of National One funding of £75,000 pa, certain criteria had to be met including seats of which a number had to be covered.

It would make sense to use temporary stands as Northampton did initially

I agree that movement up the league ladder should bring responsibilities - including infrastructure. Say 500 capacity/ of which 200 seated to join National 2, 1,000/250 National 1, 2,000/500 Championship and 5,000/1,000 Premiership. I know that Cambridge would not quite meet the seated criteria but it's something that could be addressed.
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Originally posted by FHLH FHLH wrote:

Originally posted by IainS IainS wrote:


There could have been another world in which, say, all teams in the Prem got equal funding, teams were required to have a capacity of 5,000/6,000, a realistic objective in many grounds if they use temporary stands, incremental improvements were required as you go up the tiers so clubs reaching the Championship will never be far off meeting Prem standards. Aspiration and investment would be encouraged, the league structure dynamic and exciting.


In the good old days of National One funding of £75,000 pa, certain criteria had to be met including seats of which a number had to be covered.

It would make sense to use temporary stands as Northampton did initially

I agree that movement up the league ladder should bring responsibilities - including infrastructure. Say 500 capacity/ of which 200 seated to join National 2, 1,000/250 National 1, 2,000/500 Championship and 5,000/1,000 Premiership. I know that Cambridge would not quite meet the seated criteria but it's something that could be addressed.


Why are you proposing increasing ring fencing, sport is played on the field of play not in the stands, protectionism is what is killing the game, we sure as hell don't need to expand it. 
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Paul10 View Drop Down
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Points: 539 		Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Paul10 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 19 Jan 2024 at 18:34
It's not that black and white

It's not 1 or the other.

Ring fencing and protectionism work very well in many, many sports.

Certainly not holding back F1 or NFL, is it?
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Originally posted by tigerburnie tigerburnie wrote:

Why are you proposing increasing ring fencing, sport is played on the field of play not in the stands, protectionism is what is killing the game, we sure as hell don't need to expand it. 

I hadn't perceived it as ring fencing, more getting ready for MSC - which is ring fencing. Mea culpa.

Must drink more Irn Bru before posting. Confused
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The top flight of English rugby has been effectively ring fenced for (too many) years, and it has neither produced financial stability for many of the Premiership clubs nor has the national team achieved a level of success commensurate with the available resources (since 2003).

It is time for change, not more of the same.
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Steve Diamond, who is part of the RFU panel that is dictating terms to the Championship is off to Newcastle to replace Alex Codling.
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But retains his consultancy role. But doubtless it won’t affect his views.
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John Butler42 View Drop Down
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Codling on the move YET again !
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Originally posted by John Butler42 John Butler42 wrote:

Codling on the move YET again !

I believe he is staying on at the club.

But probably not for very long!
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Steve Diamond.  Hmm.  Survivor.   Not a nice man, in my experience. 
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Sweeney at Park/Rams today. Pen & Paper in hand...
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Originally posted by FHLH FHLH wrote:

Sweeney at Park/Rams today. Pen & Paper in hand...

I'd imagine he had something more alcoholic in his hand.
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Interesting figure quoted in TheTelegraph advising that out of the total of 110 starts at inside centre in this season’s Premiership matches, 57 have been made by players who are not qualified to play for England.  In fairness, the figure of 57 includes 4 by a player who has moved to Japan mid-season.
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Not "English" 12s
Tompkins
Hutchinson 
Hawkins
Esterhuizen
Kata
Redpath
Vakatawa (Might be more 13?)

Off the top of my head so yep Telegraph might be on to something here.

Tompkins, Hutch and Redpath were English qualified but weren't picked.


Edited by Paul10 - 21 Jan 2024 at 18:29
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Originally posted by Paul10 Paul10 wrote:

Not "English"............... props

TRP had an article a month or so ago about a similar situation in the front row

(my post December 2023: "Another article in RP - 30 non-EQ props in the 10 club Premiership - mostly playing in match day 23" 


Edited by FHLH - 21 Jan 2024 at 19:32
"My father told me big men fall just as quick as little ones, if you put a sword through their hearts."
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Paul10 View Drop Down
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Originally posted by FHLH FHLH wrote:

Originally posted by Paul10 Paul10 wrote:

Not "English"............... props

TRP had an article a month or so ago about a similar situation in the front row

(my post December 2023: "Another article in RP - 30 non-EQ props in the 10 club Premiership - mostly playing in match day 23" 

I was always a back so maybe take that more seriously.


Seriously though, someone on Twitter showed many of the non-EQP props were also English qualified. Van Wyk at Leicester for example.


Edited by Paul10 - 21 Jan 2024 at 20:14
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Originally posted by rugbychris rugbychris wrote:

https://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/rugby-union/67976683


well done John Martin/ BBC Cornwall for getting a mic in front of Sweeney, altho' he managed to waffle his way out of most of the charges. The whole interview (7 mins) is HERE

Less impressed with national BBC - as reported on latest Champ Clubs Podcast, the Beeb's rugby correspondent Chris Jones described the Champ Clubs response to the Prem 2 debate as "tedious" on the BBC RU Weekly podcast last week - pretty disappointing to be dismissed like that...
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It probably IS very tedious to those among us who are only concerned with the Prem, to be fair.
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The thing is having non English players does help the progression of English qualified players, if there is an understudy who could make it. Dan Cole was stuck behind Martin Castrogiavani, Colle learnt a lot from him and eventually took over, Some not all of these players have given just as much as they have taken, the problem comes when it is not really controlled from an England point of view. This happened in France, Toulon, for example were full of overseas players and the French team faltered badly. The French RFU put in place proper controls on finance, properly funded the second tier in the game and they are now reaping the benefits, even with a constant stream of disenfranchised English men joining.

Edited by tigerburnie - 22 Jan 2024 at 21:21
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