Grass roots stirring
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Topic: Grass roots stirring
Posted By: Breakdown
Subject: Grass roots stirring
Date Posted: 01 Dec 2024 at 08:28
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https://www.telegraph.co.uk/rugby-union/2024/11/29/grass-roots-rugby-clubs-target-removal-of-bill-sweeney/" rel="nofollow - https://www.telegraph.co.uk/rugby-union/2024/11/29/grass-roots-rugby-clubs-target-removal-of-bill-sweeney/
Been here before, but feels a bit different this time. Anybody know Rob Sigley of Bournville RFC? Ex Mose. ------------- Broken down. Beyond repair. |
Replies:
Posted By: Kimbo
Date Posted: 01 Dec 2024 at 08:56
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I was thinking that Rob had a spell at Cov, but that was his brother Terry. Neither of them took a step back on the field, so I think it safe to say that Rob won't on this issue either. As an aside, today's Rugby Paper is peppered with anti-RFU/Sweeney/Ilube narrative. There's definitely a stick stirring the wasps nest, so let's hope it's the beginning of long-overdue change. ------------- Our Club |
Posted By: Big Eddie
Date Posted: 01 Dec 2024 at 09:20
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There is also very significant outrage and anger amongst the RFU's salaried staff who have been very shocked and dismayed by the recent revelations about salaries and bonuses for the RFU board at a time of some austerity for the rank and file. - earlier this year RFU rank and file employees were told that there couldn't be any salary rises because 40 staff had been made redundant and no pay increases could be afforded or justified - fuel cards which enable rank and file staff who have to travel on RFU business to buy petrol or diesel without pre funding the fuel costs themselves are having their fuel cards removed. For staff who are involved in extensive travel by car this will have a negative cash flow impact on them of up to £500 or more until their expense claims are eventually reimbursed. If the above is true it is scandalous that the people right at the top of the RFU can award themselves many £100,000's of pay rises and bonuses whilst denying the same to their staff. This is inequitable, unfair and isn't leadership. It is self enrichment of the most odious kind and personally I wouldn't respect or follow a leadership team that behaved in this way. I am sure that the Board of the RFU will come out with some self serving tosh to justify their outrageous salaries and bonuses which in my mind could never ever be justified to those that run a monopoly. It is as wrong as wrong can be ! I understand that on Monday 2nd December Bill Sweeney will be meeting with many RFU employees. He will be in for a very rough ride indeed. The lack of accountability, governance and basic fairness of the RFU to the vast majority of their member clubs (excepting of course those in the Premiership!) has been ignored by the member clubs for far too long, and now such behaviour is also affecting the rank and file staff who work for the RFU. Perhaps due to these latest very public excesses the grass roots game, at long last may, be waking up to this shocking state of affairs that has continued for way more than a decade. Something has to be done.....surely NO Council Member can turn a blind eye to this utterly disreputable state of affairs?
------------- ''The future isn't what it used to be'' |
Posted By: JZSmith
Date Posted: 01 Dec 2024 at 12:12
Well they have for years Eddie so sadly I can see very little changing. We have been here so many times before.
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Big Eddie wrote:Posted By: gerg_861
Date Posted: 01 Dec 2024 at 12:16
| Nothing happened after his select committee thrashing...why should it now? The man has no shame. https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.skysports.com/amp/rugby-union/news/12321/12754631/rfu-chief-bill-sweeney-criticised-by-dcms-select-committee-over-financial-collapse-of-wasps-and-worcester" rel="nofollow - https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.skysports.com/amp/rugby-union/news/12321/12754631/rfu-chief-bill-sweeney-criticised-by-dcms-select-committee-over-financial-collapse-of-wasps-and-worcester |
Posted By: Deva Delinquent
Date Posted: 01 Dec 2024 at 13:55
| This whole saga just stinks. |
Posted By: Camquin
Date Posted: 01 Dec 2024 at 19:31
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It needs to stink enough that the chairman of the Felpersham club playing in the Borsetshire County Merit Tables can smell it. As long as Bill Sweeney has the proxy votes from those smaller clubs, he can get defeat a motion of sanction at a General Meeting. And they have so little to do with the RFU, they generally do not vote. ------------- Sweeney Delenda Est |
Posted By: JohnLowe
Date Posted: 01 Dec 2024 at 22:23
| I can recall attending a RFU AGM and sitting next to two services delegates who had wads of votes they had in their possession for the various stations they represented. |
Posted By: Breakdown
Date Posted: 01 Dec 2024 at 23:51
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It will be interesting to see if the Community Clubs Union manages to rouse up enough feeling. ------------- Broken down. Beyond repair. |
Posted By: Camquin
Date Posted: 02 Dec 2024 at 12:24
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I fear the Community Clubs Union has a lot of similarities to Voltaire's description of the Holy Roman Empire. ------------- Sweeney Delenda Est |
Posted By: islander
Date Posted: 02 Dec 2024 at 20:05
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Posted By: Camquin
Date Posted: 04 Dec 2024 at 22:04
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The Telegraph are reporting that an emergency Council meeting has been called for the 18th. Lobby you Council member. ------------- Sweeney Delenda Est |
Posted By: Halliford
Date Posted: 05 Dec 2024 at 09:39
| NLR have asked Member Clubs for opinions ahead of that meeting to support our 1 Council Member. Our CB has yet to make contact. |
Posted By: Breakdown
Date Posted: 05 Dec 2024 at 12:10
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I had been picking up rumours that a lot of Nat League clubs were unhappy their views on BS etc were not being transmitted by their rep. Anyone else hear that? ------------- Broken down. Beyond repair. |
Posted By: FHLH
Date Posted: 07 Dec 2024 at 00:32
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Past presidents call for https://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/rugby-union/articles/c70eeeqqw2jo" rel="nofollow - resignations ------------- "My father told me big men fall just as quick as little ones, if you put a sword through their hearts." |
Posted By: Paul10
Date Posted: 07 Dec 2024 at 06:46
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Nat 1 clubs and former RFU Chairmen are not Grass Roots. I am a member of 2 grass roots clubs (1st teams in L7 & 9). This story hasn't been mentioned in my various WhatsApp groups. We're more worried about fixing floodlights and hoping the storm passes without smashing anything or flooding the pitches. EDIT I'm up for BS going and will report back if I hear anything. In fact a pre match lunch ina fortnight will have the county allickadoos down.
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Posted By: gerg_861
Date Posted: 07 Dec 2024 at 07:17
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Bill Swiney, the RFU master For rugby, he's been a disaster,. He’d count every pound, His wealth would resound, A miserly man, money-hungry. |
Posted By: gerg_861
Date Posted: 08 Dec 2024 at 10:06
| All 12 champ clubs have called for Sweeney and co. To step down per several publications. |
Posted By: JZSmith
Date Posted: 08 Dec 2024 at 11:23
It would probably be easier to list the clubs that actually want him to continue. |
Posted By: fatbear
Date Posted: 09 Dec 2024 at 12:41
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Here is the statement posted on the Chinnor website. https://www.chinnor-rfc.com/news/club-statement-2890020.html" rel="nofollow - https://www.chinnor-rfc.com/news/club-statement-2890020.html
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Posted By: NeverbeentoChinnor
Date Posted: 09 Dec 2024 at 22:53
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Bill Sweeney has been the RFU's chief executive since May 2019, after serving in a similar role at the British Olympic Association
Clubs in English rugby's second tier have united to demand a debate on a vote of no confidence in the leadership of the Rugby Football Union. Championship clubs have called on RFU president Rob Udwin to convene a Special General Meeting to discuss a vote of no confidence in the organisation's chairman Tom Ilube and chief executive Bill Sweeney. The clubs are unhappy after Sweeney was paid a bonus of £358,000 despite the RFU posting a record operating loss of nearly £40m. Sweeney - whose total remuneration was £1.1m - was one of six executives who shared a bonus pot of £1.3m at a time when the union is making more than 40 people redundant. The 12 clubs said in a statement that they "could no longer stand by and allow the current situation, and the unaccountable decision making that led to it, to continue without challenge". They added a vote would allow "the first steps to fundamental change" to be taken. Ampthill, Bedford Blues, Caldy, Cambridge, Chinnor, Cornish Pirates, Coventry, Doncaster, Ealing Trailfinders, Hartpury, London Scottish and Nottingham are the 12 teams who make up the current Championship. |
Posted By: FHLH
Date Posted: 11 Dec 2024 at 13:35
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Pirates look for https://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/rugby-union/articles/c1j0p16wgkko" rel="nofollow - Government support Translation please (part of RFU response) "The objective has been to create a second tier that supports the English rugby system by developing young English talent, whilst supporting the clubs to become financially sustainable by growing local audiences, improving standards, and increasing the value of the league. "Significant research has been undertaken and external independent advice sought to underpin the strategy. Minimum standards have been proposed along with increased RFU funding and a mechanic for promotion and relegation with tiered capacities for entry into the Premiership and a governance structure to give greater self-determination." ------------- "My father told me big men fall just as quick as little ones, if you put a sword through their hearts." |
Posted By: FHLH
Date Posted: 11 Dec 2024 at 13:37
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If Sweeney goes, how much will his settlement be? ------------- "My father told me big men fall just as quick as little ones, if you put a sword through their hearts." |
Posted By: Paul10
Date Posted: 11 Dec 2024 at 14:40
Probably north of £1M Last WRU CEO negotiated a >£500k payoff after completely trashing the sport and what was left of the reputation of the Union.
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Posted By: Camquin
Date Posted: 11 Dec 2024 at 15:33
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It depends on whether that are permitted to resign, or are dismissed with prejudice. ------------- Sweeney Delenda Est |
Posted By: Mark W-J
Date Posted: 11 Dec 2024 at 15:41
| If he goes - and I'd say it's a very big if - then I doubt he will resign, and there are absolutely no grounds for dismissal. As bad as the optics are, he's not taken a bonus for three years and instead signed up to an LTIP for which he has hit around 75% of his targets. The fact that those targets are weighted and blended doesn't make any difference to his performance against his objectives. The issue is with the people who set those targets, and the remuneration committee who signed-off on the payment of the LTIP in a year when the RFU has lost £40m. But if he falls to the weight of public opinion - and he's never given two hoots for public opinion during his time at the RFU - then it will be very carefully negotiated and he will walk away with another seven figure sum. |
Posted By: gerg_861
Date Posted: 11 Dec 2024 at 21:00
I suspect you are 100% correct. What pig willingly lifts its snout from the trough? If a parliamentary beasting didn't phase him, the rugby community's oppobrium certainly won't.
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Posted By: FHLH
Date Posted: 11 Dec 2024 at 22:41
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Do a year's gardening leave at grounds throughout England mowing the lawns
------------- "My father told me big men fall just as quick as little ones, if you put a sword through their hearts." |
Posted By: Steve@Mose
Date Posted: 18 Dec 2024 at 10:16
http://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/rugby-union/articles/c62z6v80188o" rel="nofollow - National League 1 clubs join calls for overhaul
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Posted By: KnightsBoy
Date Posted: 18 Dec 2024 at 10:19
Any idea why Mosley are not on this list as having signed?
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Posted By: Rothman2
Date Posted: 18 Dec 2024 at 10:51
| Or Bishops Stortford. |
Posted By: Steve@Mose
Date Posted: 18 Dec 2024 at 11:24
I personally have no idea as to Moseley's position regarding the letter. So far to date I have seen no statement nor response issued by the club regarding the letter.
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Posted By: islander
Date Posted: 18 Dec 2024 at 16:12
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Will Kelleher of the Times reporting this afternoon that a SGM has been triggered & is due to take place by 28/2/25 Tom Ilube and Bill Sweeney will face a historic vote of no confidence before the end of the Six Nations after a grassroots rebellion gathered enough support to demand a special general meeting, The Times can reveal. The revolt has left Ilube, the RFU chairman, and Sweeney, the chief executive, on the brink of being ousted by the community game in England, whose anger was triggered by https://www.thetimes.com/article/d80f8fee-4048-41fb-9fe9-e6baa9f09971" rel="nofollow - the executive pay row at Twickenham. The motion, to be voted upon by all member clubs, will force the dismissal of Ilube or the chairman to resign from his post. Clubs will also vote on a resolution that calls for the RFU board to dismiss Sweeney. The motions will need a two-thirds majority to pass. “We believe this will be successful,” one source said. “This is translating anger into action. The game doesn’t want those people to stay.” The Rugby Football Referees Union (RFRU) and the 12 clubs in the RFU-run Championship joined forces to rally member clubs into supporting a special general meeting (SGM) and to finalise the wording of the motion. A letter will be sent to the RFU before the end of the week. |
Posted By: Thatbloke
Date Posted: 18 Dec 2024 at 17:07
| Hallelujah! Both just fall on your swords and go - you're not wanted and have done the game a great disservice! |
Posted By: One For The Ditch
Date Posted: 18 Dec 2024 at 18:04
Check your Email TB
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Posted By: rugbychris
Date Posted: 18 Dec 2024 at 18:32
| Not heard anything from Kent CB about this emergency meeting. Let's hope the council can do the right thing and then hope that the RFU can make the right appointments |
Posted By: FHLH
Date Posted: 18 Dec 2024 at 18:39
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Be careful what you wish for. # Sweeney dismissal will cost £m #They'll never fall on sword # Who will sit on recruitment panel? # Who wants the interim job? Me?
------------- "My father told me big men fall just as quick as little ones, if you put a sword through their hearts." |
Posted By: Camquin
Date Posted: 18 Dec 2024 at 20:02
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I am not sure how much compensation he would be entitled to if dismissed by a General Meeting But, he has two months to work that out, or if he can indeed be dismissed. He has access to the best lawyers - and the RFU will pay for them, unless this could be later ruled ultra vires. Of course, the SGM could vote to dissolve the Union. ------------- Sweeney Delenda Est |
Posted By: rugbychris
Date Posted: 18 Dec 2024 at 20:34
| The more negative press the RFU and Sweeney receive the more his stock diminishes. If he wants to be employable after his RFU tenure he may walk before it gets worse. |
Posted By: Thatbloke
Date Posted: 19 Dec 2024 at 11:29
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If only............ The BIG problem is getting sufficient clubs to vote. My understanding is that 1,221 clubs need to vote in favour to push it through (2/3rds of the 1,849 member clubs). Not helped by a complicated voting process - will Old Dufferonians RFC playing at Level 12 and hundreds more like them be bothered to vote. Sadly, I suspect apathy will prevail. UNLESS, of course, I have misunderstood the voting process - others on here may be better informed?
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Posted By: FHLH
Date Posted: 19 Dec 2024 at 14:02
The there's the individual Services Regiments and Oxford / Cambridge colleges
------------- "My father told me big men fall just as quick as little ones, if you put a sword through their hearts." |
Posted By: islander
Date Posted: 19 Dec 2024 at 15:18
| Times report 'hot-off-press' that Tom Ilube is set to stand down & be replaced by Bill Beaumont (serving in an interim capacity to 'steady the ship'). Do RFU hope that'll be enough to take the heat off BS?! Hmmmm... |
Posted By: FHLH
Date Posted: 19 Dec 2024 at 15:33
Cheapest option and he's close to Fylde - or was when we played them, so might pick up smoke signals from Nat 2 ------------- "My father told me big men fall just as quick as little ones, if you put a sword through their hearts." |
Posted By: Thatbloke
Date Posted: 19 Dec 2024 at 15:39
| 1 down, 1 to go! |
Posted By: KnightsBoy
Date Posted: 19 Dec 2024 at 17:21
Only1 more go?? Surely there's more dead wood to chuck out
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Posted By: tigerburnie
Date Posted: 19 Dec 2024 at 17:23
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This has stalling, greasy, trying to wriggle out of it written all over it https://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/rugby-union/articles/cgrwyn9l0jjo" rel="nofollow - RFU pay: Bill Sweeney & Tom Ilube could face vote of no confidence as review of executive pay to begin - BBC Sport
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Posted By: Paul10
Date Posted: 19 Dec 2024 at 17:37
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Wales have been stuck with Nigel Walker for too long and previously Ieuan Evans was patently not up to the job. (Brilliant wingers but not large company execs) The RFU needs to make sure if BB is back then it is very interim.
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Posted By: Breakdown
Date Posted: 19 Dec 2024 at 19:40
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Ilube chucked under bus to save Sweeney. These people have no shame. Beaumont should not have allowed himself to be involved in it. ------------- Broken down. Beyond repair. |
Posted By: islander
Date Posted: 19 Dec 2024 at 21:13
Times podcast questioned the merits of the 'golden handcuffs' attempts by the RFU in 2021 (when the long-term incentive plan that's just come to fruition was put in place), given that BS was aged 64 then (so 67 now) & arguably won't be seeking f/t employment when he leaves Twickenham, while 2 others (Sue Day and Hugo M-T) had left anyway...
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Posted By: Thatbloke
Date Posted: 19 Dec 2024 at 22:13
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As has been alluded to Ilube goes in an attempt to save Sweeney - who IS this guy's Fairy Godmother? It's yet another mis-read by our governing body! Let's appoint some more Consultant's to review the pay packages for executive officers (at a cost of £???? million) That will keep the peasants quiet for another 12 to 18 months whilst we continue to keep our noses in the trough and continue to mis-manage the game of rugby union. They just don't get it do they? It's not really about this latest debacle and who gets paid what, it's the straw that broke the camel's back after a catalogue of mis-management over the last few years. Just over a year ago Ilube scolded us for having the audacity to raise our concerns on the eve of a World Cup stating we should all get behind the England team - another mis-read! Would I like to have a successful England team? Yes I would. Is it the reason I and thousands of other volunteers pour hours and hours into our local clubs. Absolutely not. We do it to provide rugby to as many individuals as possible regardless of their abilty whilst keeping our clubs afloat (ideally with some sort of support from our governing body - he coughs and splutters!!) and providing sporting facilities for our communities in which we live. Sadly, the RFU have become a disgrace over the last few years and for that we can only blame those in charge and their time is most definitely well and truly up. The leadership is no longer fit for purpose - indeed I suspect there are many club chairmen up and down the land who could do an excellent job heading up our sport - not because they have been plucked from an "Executive Recruitment Search" but because they understand rugby and have been involved in the game for many a year. We need change and we need it now - let's all ensure we make it happen
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Posted By: Rothman2
Date Posted: 20 Dec 2024 at 02:52
| Well said ThatBloke 👏👏👏👏 |
Posted By: rugbychris
Date Posted: 20 Dec 2024 at 08:11
| Agree 💯 |
Posted By: JZSmith
Date Posted: 20 Dec 2024 at 11:23
| If true can you imagine how much of our (rugby's) money will find its way into Ilube's bank account? |
Posted By: Thatbloke
Date Posted: 20 Dec 2024 at 11:26
| Everything I said above just confirmed by a letter from the RFU President sent to all member clubs. Clueless and totally disconected from who they purport to serve and represent |
Posted By: Breakdown
Date Posted: 20 Dec 2024 at 12:10
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Ilube's statement says he will stay on till a new chair is in post. That could be months, during which time he remains the only person who can sack Sweeney. Their tactics are transparent, but it doesn't mean they shouldn't be opposed. I am asking my club to write to Udwin now and tell him Ilube must step down immediately. ------------- Broken down. Beyond repair. |
Posted By: One For The Ditch
Date Posted: 20 Dec 2024 at 13:40
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What is shocking, based on the present number of signatories to the letter requesting an SGM, is the apathy of some members of the Union. The Championship and Nat 1 clubs have stepped up to the plate but only a small percentage of lower level clubs. If we know of clubs not getting involved, they must be lobbied and encouraged to engage, otherwise we will achieve nothing.
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Posted By: Robb
Date Posted: 20 Dec 2024 at 14:21
Agreed absolutely. I certainly reckon that I-Lube has jumped before hes pushed but it may well be hes just doing that to play well in the press in order to protect Sweeny and the others. I bet they are assuming that most people don't know how the RFU structure works and think that a public resignation will dampen enthusiasm for more clubs to sign the call for the EGM. I just hope many more clubs do not get distracted and continue to join the grassroots rebellion.
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Posted By: Paul10
Date Posted: 20 Dec 2024 at 15:20
Nigel Walker resigns. A decent man who got out of his depth.
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Posted By: Thatbloke
Date Posted: 20 Dec 2024 at 15:35
| I'm not sure how to share the open Presidents letter to Member Clubs on here but if you PM me with a mobile nunber I can WhatsApp you a copy. Within the letter there is an assertion that adult playing numbers are up (and we all know this is only because casual players have to be registered on GMS!) but totally lost on him. I'm afraid the President is showing himself to be just as culpable as the rest of them |
Posted By: One For The Ditch
Date Posted: 20 Dec 2024 at 16:47
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Here you go TB: |
Posted By: One For The Ditch
Date Posted: 20 Dec 2024 at 16:58
Here you go TB:
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Posted By: Thatbloke
Date Posted: 20 Dec 2024 at 17:08
| Many thanks OFTD |
Posted By: FHLH
Date Posted: 20 Dec 2024 at 17:23
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dooes anyone know what the "Community Game Forward Project" is? I can't find it in any reports. "........our Community Game Future Project has now planned our first multiyear community game investment of £30m a year against a prioritised roadmap with specific plans targeted at growing the game." ------------- "My father told me big men fall just as quick as little ones, if you put a sword through their hearts." |
Posted By: Thatbloke
Date Posted: 20 Dec 2024 at 17:29
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Probably just created to try and appease the 'peasants' "Prioritised Roadmap" -.............. For God's sake!!!!
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Posted By: FHLH
Date Posted: 20 Dec 2024 at 18:13
M25, A316 ------------- "My father told me big men fall just as quick as little ones, if you put a sword through their hearts." |
Posted By: One For The Ditch
Date Posted: 20 Dec 2024 at 18:49
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It is a totally disingenuous letter. Let’s be clear, were it not for dedicated players and battered volunteers the community game would be in an even worse position. How Udwin has the gaul to suggest that the RFU are in any way responsible for growing numbers is beyond believe. Clubs are leaving leagues, walkovers still persist. He sits in cloud cuckoo land and should form an orderly queue behind the CEO and march off down the A316. Oh, Happy Christmas one and all, all the best, OFTD
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Posted By: gerg_861
Date Posted: 24 Dec 2024 at 09:58
| To quote Bon Jovi: We're halfway there... |
Posted By: Camquin
Date Posted: 24 Dec 2024 at 10:07
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I think Churchill is a better quote This is not the end, it is not even the beginning of the end, but it is the end of the beginning. ------------- Sweeney Delenda Est |
Posted By: gerg_861
Date Posted: 24 Dec 2024 at 11:54
Agreed, much more apt.
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Posted By: JZSmith
Date Posted: 24 Dec 2024 at 11:55
To be fair he is correct in saying the RFU are responsible for growing numbers. They are responsible for this along with many other matters. The problem is that for far too long they have washed their hands of these responsibilities and it is now time the whole senior management should be held to account. Whether they will be of course is another matter.
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Posted By: tulip
Date Posted: 24 Dec 2024 at 14:51
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A very nice Christmas message from the President of Irish Rugby “To the volunteers in every Club, your commitment and tireless effort are the backbone of Irish Rugby Whether it’s managing teams,supporting players or ensuring the smooth running of your Clubs,you make a profound difference every day.Your time, energy,and love for the game are the fuel that keeps the sport thriving at all levels,and for that,we are deeply grateful.” Anything from the President of the RFU
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Posted By: kempstonblue
Date Posted: 24 Dec 2024 at 21:26
The RFU are frantically looking for a new way to stop this forum operating. ------------- The older I get, the more the RFU leave me confused. |
Posted By: gerg_861
Date Posted: 24 Dec 2024 at 22:05
Disdain
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Posted By: Robb
Date Posted: 25 Dec 2024 at 10:09
So that's why it went down for a few days over the last week!
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Posted By: sedgley dave
Date Posted: 26 Dec 2024 at 12:30
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I fear for the Irish, lacking a prioritised roadmap. Passion, commitment, love? Bah! Humbug! Give me a roadmap any day.
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Posted By: FHLH
Date Posted: 26 Dec 2024 at 13:07
Methinks we need a "reset" I've no idea what it means or what's involved but I'm sure the £m being spent on consultancy could add that to their remit. ------------- "My father told me big men fall just as quick as little ones, if you put a sword through their hearts." |
Posted By: JZSmith
Date Posted: 27 Dec 2024 at 11:12
Plus we clearly need to be on a "journey" as part of the "project".
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Posted By: One For The Ditch
Date Posted: 31 Dec 2024 at 11:13
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Posted By: Neasham
Date Posted: 31 Dec 2024 at 13:28
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What they have done is impose a very clunky and complex GMS system on all clubs including those totally run by (often ageing ) volunteers. They now insist that anyone playing the sport, even youngsters and very occasional vets, register themselves. Soon even geriatric walking rugby players will have to register. So, at the press of a button they will be able to produce a report for Sport England showing what a good job they’re doing. Largely smoke and mirrors.
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