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RFU Survey

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Category: League Rugby - www.leaguerugby.co.uk
Forum Name: Clubhouse chat
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URL: http://www.leaguerugby.co.uk/forum_posts.asp?TID=19748
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Topic: RFU Survey
Posted By: corporalcarrot
Subject: RFU Survey
Date Posted: 06 Apr 2023 at 07:26
https://surveys.tell-us-what-you-think.com/s3/6eaa52a834d5?spMailingID=25202593&spUserID=Njc0OTkwNzk1OTUxS0&spJobID=2210487815&spReportId=MjIxMDQ4NzgxNQS2" rel="nofollow - The Future of Professional Rugby in England (tell-us-what-you-think.com)
I haven't looked at it. On principle I reject anything which requires me to surrender private data on an unqualified basis.


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Dont kick it. Pick it up and GO FORWARD.



Replies:
Posted By: Intouch
Date Posted: 06 Apr 2023 at 07:41
Another £200k thrown out the window, when they could have funded the Champ or National 1 better.




Posted By: Camquin
Date Posted: 06 Apr 2023 at 08:21
It is also a terrible survey.


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Sweeney Delenda Est


Posted By: kingsheathlad
Date Posted: 06 Apr 2023 at 08:23
Agree. An absolute waste. 

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Cauliflower ear.


Posted By: billesleyexile
Date Posted: 06 Apr 2023 at 08:39
Originally posted by Camquin Camquin wrote:

It is also a terrible survey.

I don't know - you can have some fun with the open enders (I just have). 

What I found particularly frustrating was the assumption that there's anything they could do to make me watch Championship rugby that wouldn't involve the club I support being in the Championship.


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keep the faith


Posted By: billesleyexile
Date Posted: 06 Apr 2023 at 08:40
Originally posted by Intouch Intouch wrote:

Another £200k thrown out the window, when they could have funded the Champ or National 1 better.



I do this for a living - £10-15k max assuming it's being done externally. However, it's very much the sort of thing that most people ought to be able to do internally. 


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keep the faith


Posted By: Kimbo
Date Posted: 06 Apr 2023 at 09:19
I've wasted my time on FU 'surveys' in the past.
Nothing positive ever seems to result.
Not doing it again.


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Our City,
Our Club


Posted By: One For The Ditch
Date Posted: 06 Apr 2023 at 09:41
Originally posted by corporalcarrot corporalcarrot wrote:

https://surveys.tell-us-what-you-think.com/s3/6eaa52a834d5?spMailingID=25202593&spUserID=Njc0OTkwNzk1OTUxS0&spJobID=2210487815&spReportId=MjIxMDQ4NzgxNQS2" rel="nofollow - The Future of Professional Rugby in England (tell-us-what-you-think.com)
I haven't looked at it. On principle I reject anything which requires me to surrender private data on an unqualified basis.

They will not take a blind bit of notice!


Posted By: tigerburnie
Date Posted: 06 Apr 2023 at 09:46
A box ticked, no-one can accuse them of doing nothing and when any awkward questions are asked later they fudge the answer by saying they are awaiting a report and as it's external, it's not their fault. Seen dozens of them, latest version of walking around all day with a bit of paper in their hand trying to look busy.......................................doing nothing


Posted By: Kimbo
Date Posted: 06 Apr 2023 at 11:52
Originally posted by tigerburnie tigerburnie wrote:

A box ticked, no-one can accuse them of doing nothing and when any awkward questions are asked later they fudge the answer by saying they are awaiting a report and as it's external, it's not their fault. Seen dozens of them, latest version of walking around all day with a bit of paper in their hand trying to look busy.......................................doing nothing
Exactly.


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Our City,
Our Club


Posted By: Richard Lowther
Date Posted: 06 Apr 2023 at 12:21

The RFU can't really win. If they issue a survey, people criticise it, if they don't issue a survey, people complain they have not been consulted. 

If 'critics' of any plans don't have their say it plays into the hands of those that support them, therefore presenting a defacto 'win' for the RFU.

In essence you are cutting off your nose to spite your face. 



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Moderator http://www.leaguerugby.co.uk" rel="nofollow - National League Rugby Message Boards



Remember Wakefield RFC


Posted By: billesleyexile
Date Posted: 06 Apr 2023 at 13:10
Originally posted by Richard Lowther Richard Lowther wrote:


The RFU can't really win. If they issue a survey, people criticise it, if they don't issue a survey, people complain they have not been consulted. 

If 'critics' of any plans don't have their say it plays into the hands of those that support them, therefore presenting a defacto 'win' for the RFU.

In essence you are cutting off your nose to spite your face. 


Agree. It's boring, we've heard it all before, and it never feels like anything is going to change, but never pass up an opportunity to feed back to the RFU. 

If nothing else, if the feedback is particularly splenetic it can have the benefit of making you feel better! 

I gave them both barrels in the open ended text boxes this morning. Is it going to change anything? No. Have I had my say regardless? Yes. 


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keep the faith


Posted By: corporalcarrot
Date Posted: 06 Apr 2023 at 13:13
Originally posted by Richard Lowther Richard Lowther wrote:


The RFU can't really win. If they issue a survey, people criticise it, if they don't issue a survey, people complain they have not been consulted. 

If 'critics' of any plans don't have their say it plays into the hands of those that support them, therefore presenting a defacto 'win' for the RFU.

In essence you are cutting off your nose to spite your face. 

I agree with this which is why I posted the link to allow others to contribute if they choose. On a personal basis I wont participate because of the personal data concerns but accept I may be overly cautious in this regard. 

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Dont kick it. Pick it up and GO FORWARD.


Posted By: WILD BOAR
Date Posted: 06 Apr 2023 at 13:23
Sort of agree Richard, but following their complete mis-management of the 'Tackle Law' this may be a way forward.

Will be interesting to see if they publish the findings in full?

Personally I would like to see a 10 team (sustainably funded) Premiership & Championship, along with a 14 team National One (North & South) with at least officials and travel totally funded.

Below this go back to N2 N,M,SW, L&SE...rather than the 3 way split which is a mess.












Posted By: billesleyexile
Date Posted: 06 Apr 2023 at 13:45
Originally posted by WILD BOAR WILD BOAR wrote:

Sort of agree Richard, but following their complete mis-management of the 'Tackle Law' this may be a way forward.

Will be interesting to see if they publish the findings in full?

Personally I would like to see a 10 team (sustainably funded) Premiership & Championship, along with a 14 team National One (North & South) with at least officials and travel totally funded.

Below this go back to N2 N,M,SW, L&SE...rather than the 3 way split which is a mess.


Can't support that unless it's part of a whole game solution that expressly addresses the gap that will create/widen between levels 2 and 3. And that's not self-interest speaking, I'd have the same issue if dealing with that gap moved it to between levels 3 and 4. 

We need to come up with a smooth pathway from level 9 to level 1 (9-2 as an absolute minimum). While I favour central contracts for England players, I can see the need for a professional club tier to give them game time. I'm unconvinced that there's a need for as many pro clubs as are currently in the premiership, never mind trying to get to 20. I think the future is a smaller, better professional game, and a more equitable settlement for the rest of the game (or, to put it another way, virtually everyone who plays or is involved in rugby in any capacity in the country).

I don't think any solution should involve shovelling the sport's money into the mouths of the Championship clubs at the expense of the other 2000 clubs. 

A small increase in the number of haves vs the enormous number of have nots is not a win for me.


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keep the faith


Posted By: WILD BOAR
Date Posted: 06 Apr 2023 at 13:56
Yes, agree with central contracts.

Championship to remain semi-pro.


Posted By: Steve@Mose
Date Posted: 06 Apr 2023 at 14:07
Originally posted by corporalcarrot corporalcarrot wrote:

https://surveys.tell-us-what-you-think.com/s3/6eaa52a834d5?spMailingID=25202593&spUserID=Njc0OTkwNzk1OTUxS0&spJobID=2210487815&spReportId=MjIxMDQ4NzgxNQS2" rel="nofollow - The Future of Professional Rugby in England (tell-us-what-you-think.com)
I haven't looked at it. On principle I reject anything which requires me to surrender private data on an unqualified basis.

Having completed this survey they do ask for the first part of your postcode, and at the end ask if you would like to enter your email address to take part in a draw for tickets to a RWC warm-up match.  No requirement to enter your email so you can submit your survey without doing so.


Posted By: Richard Lowther
Date Posted: 06 Apr 2023 at 14:35
We could argue on a structure for the game forever and still never make everyone happy.

We need to agree on the basics. Reduce costs, travel time whilst balancing out the 'right' number of fixtures.

We need to understand what the purpose of the Premiership and Championship are. My view is to serve the national team and I would support central contracts. 

I don't think the game can afford twenty top teams, either financially or quality wise to ensure competitive leagues. 

We must ensure that promotion and relegation remains the bedrock of any league system, and based purely on field achievement without imposing restrictions on ground capacity etc. 

Saying all that I don't think a national league structure suits all and some alternatives should be investigated for those that want it. 


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Moderator http://www.leaguerugby.co.uk" rel="nofollow - National League Rugby Message Boards



Remember Wakefield RFC


Posted By: tigerburnie
Date Posted: 06 Apr 2023 at 14:37
Surveys are useful, if they are used and action taken on the findings, it's the track record of the RFU that stinks.


Posted By: Neasham
Date Posted: 06 Apr 2023 at 15:03
Agree they are useful if the survey comes first then the policy.


Posted By: Camquin
Date Posted: 06 Apr 2023 at 15:10
The problem is with those that use surveys the way a Huckleberryly Pear uses a lamppost, for support not illumination.

Thanks to A.E. Houseman, and others.


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Sweeney Delenda Est


Posted By: Raider999
Date Posted: 06 Apr 2023 at 22:02
Originally posted by WILD BOAR WILD BOAR wrote:

Sort of agree Richard, but following their complete mis-management of the 'Tackle Law' this may be a way forward.

Will be interesting to see if they publish the findings in full?

Personally I would like to see a 10 team (sustainably funded) Premiership & Championship, along with a 14 team National One (North & South) with at least officials and travel totally funded.

Below this go back to N2 N,M,SW, L&SE...rather than the 3 way split which is a mess.












That would dilute N2 even more. More of a level 5 from 2-3 years ago

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RAID ON


Posted By: kempstonblue
Date Posted: 07 Apr 2023 at 02:56
Would rather they had a structure that non rugby folk can get. Not one that changes every other year.

Look at football since Prem League
92  clubs. 4 league’s.

Biggest changes. Football national North/South since 2004.
Last change 2017 saw a second Southern League Premier.







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The older I get, the more the RFU leave me confused.


Posted By: Marlovian
Date Posted: 07 Apr 2023 at 08:45
Closed questions can be rigged to give the answers wanted so are useless. My sequence of answers gave no open questions just tick boxes. Nowhere to state that Sweeney is an absolute disgrace. Nowhere to suggest that cutting Sweeney's salary could increase championship funding by 50%. Pure lip service.

Maybe I should have pretended to support a premiership team, after all they are the only ones that matter except for Worcs, Wasps, Newcastle, Irish....


Posted By: rugbychris
Date Posted: 07 Apr 2023 at 09:34
I was asked questions about what improvements could be made to encourage me to watch more champ rugby.

The same questions kept coming up.

Improving atmosphere 
Improving quality of rugby
Improving facilities 
More young English players
Promotion
Closer games

They are all going to receive high percentages. But are they going to dictate any long term strategy and planning. Doubt it.

Championship to be turned into prem academy league with all matches played at prem stadiums.

The RFU listened to its supporters who said they wanted to see more young English players in stadiums with better facilities in closely contested exciting matches.

I'm a tad cynical LOL


Posted By: tigerburnie
Date Posted: 07 Apr 2023 at 09:39
It seems from a distance that the game hasn't changed that much off the field, the league system is not allowed to work, like it does for example in soccer. The old school tie invitational approach is still there.


Posted By: Brizzer
Date Posted: 07 Apr 2023 at 09:48
Originally posted by kempstonblue kempstonblue wrote:

Would rather they had a structure that non rugby folk can get. Not one that changes every other year.

Look at football since Prem League
92  clubs. 4 league’s.

Biggest changes. Football national North/South since 2004.
Last change 2017 saw a second Southern League Premier.
[DIV





Ah rugby and football. There is so much that the two sports can learn from each other. On the field, rugby is excellent. It begins at grass roots with respect which goes all the way through to the very highest level. Respect of the laws, respect of how they are interpreted, respect of your opposite number, respect of your team mates and above all respect of the officials. Football could learn so much in this department where the on field antics is nothing short of embarrassing. Apparently, to win the game you have to get as many of the opposition sent off as you can. However, off the field rugby could learn so much from football, especially with structure and governance. They do not always get it right, but it is so much better than rugby, especially with the marketing and exploitation of the sport.

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Tackle Low!!!!!


Posted By: tigerburnie
Date Posted: 07 Apr 2023 at 14:55
I would say we are seeing examples of rugby players diving and milking a non injury to get players carded, so it is catching up with the football embarrassment. I remember I was taught you never let your opposite number know he had hurt you, even if he had. Some of the current drop will qualify for an equity card these days.


Posted By: kempstonblue
Date Posted: 07 Apr 2023 at 18:06
Had a look at the survey.

Was this devised by Vladamir Putin?
We want to know what your thinking and if it corresponds with our thinking.


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The older I get, the more the RFU leave me confused.


Posted By: WEvans
Date Posted: 08 Apr 2023 at 13:42
Originally posted by Brizzer Brizzer wrote:

Originally posted by kempstonblue kempstonblue wrote:

Would rather they had a structure that non rugby folk can get. Not one that changes every other year.

Look at football since Prem League
92  clubs. 4 league’s.

Biggest changes. Football national North/South since 2004.
Last change 2017 saw a second Southern League Premier.
[DIV





Ah rugby and football. There is so much that the two sports can learn from each other. On the field, rugby is excellent. It begins at grass roots with respect which goes all the way through to the very highest level. Respect of the laws, respect of how they are interpreted, respect of your opposite number, respect of your team mates and above all respect of the officials. Football could learn so much in this department where the on field antics is nothing short of embarrassing. Apparently, to win the game you have to get as many of the opposition sent off as you can. However, off the field rugby could learn so much from football, especially with structure and governance. They do not always get it right, but it is so much better than rugby, especially with the marketing and exploitation of the sport.

As tigerburnie has said there are increasing signs of the onfield football beaviour you mention happening in rugby and sadly I see almost every one of your "respect of the laws, respect of how they are interpreted, respect of your opposite number, respect of your team mates and above all respect of the officials" codes being broken in just about every professional rugby match I watch nowadays.

And personally I don't want to see my sport exploited. I'd rather just see it run properly.  


Posted By: tigerburnie
Date Posted: 08 Apr 2023 at 20:17
Originally posted by WEvans WEvans wrote:

Originally posted by Brizzer Brizzer wrote:

Originally posted by kempstonblue kempstonblue wrote:

Would rather they had a structure that non rugby folk can get. Not one that changes every other year.

Look at football since Prem League
92  clubs. 4 league’s.

Biggest changes. Football national North/South since 2004.
Last change 2017 saw a second Southern League Premier.
[DIV





Ah rugby and football. There is so much that the two sports can learn from each other. On the field, rugby is excellent. It begins at grass roots with respect which goes all the way through to the very highest level. Respect of the laws, respect of how they are interpreted, respect of your opposite number, respect of your team mates and above all respect of the officials. Football could learn so much in this department where the on field antics is nothing short of embarrassing. Apparently, to win the game you have to get as many of the opposition sent off as you can. However, off the field rugby could learn so much from football, especially with structure and governance. They do not always get it right, but it is so much better than rugby, especially with the marketing and exploitation of the sport.

As tigerburnie has said there are increasing signs of the onfield football beaviour you mention happening in rugby and sadly I see almost every one of your "respect of the laws, respect of how they are interpreted, respect of your opposite number, respect of your team mates and above all respect of the officials" codes being broken in just about every professional rugby match I watch nowadays.

And personally I don't want to see my sport exploited. I'd rather just see it run properly.  
Recent example England v Ireland and Freddie Stewards card, which was rescinded after the game was lost(England would probably have still lost though)



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