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Promotion and Relegation 2023 for Level 5 and belo |
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Front Jumper 
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 Topic: Promotion and Relegation 2023 for Level 5 and beloPosted: 13 Mar 2023 at 11:34 |
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Whats the news about promotion and relegation Levels 5, 6, and 7 Any ideas guys!
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One For The Ditch
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Posted: 13 Mar 2023 at 11:54 |
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Not that I know, but it might be dependent on what happens at level 1 and 2. Hopefully the dire England performance, on Saturday, might suggest to the head sheds that ringfencing the Premiership is inept.
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Neasham
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Posted: 13 Mar 2023 at 12:09 |
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Looked this up only yesterday.
National 1 will see the top club promoted to the Championship (subject to Regulation 5), while the bottom side three (3) clubs will be relegated or such other number as notified by the RFU to the clubs. National 2 and Regional Leagues will see the top clubs in each league promoted to a league above, with the bottom two (2) clubs in each League relegated. Clubs who are relegated from Regional 2, will return to their Constituent Bodies Counties league. Promotion for Counties and belowCounties 1 will see the top club in each League promoted a League above. Any remaining spaces in the higher league that are needed to be populated will be determined at the end of the season. Counties 2 and below will see the following apply: i. where one League feeds into one higher League: the top two clubs in the supporting Leagues at the end of the season will be promoted to the Level above. ii. where two Leagues feed into one higher League: the top club in each of the supporting Leagues at the end of the season will be promoted to the Level above. iii. in respect of all cases, any remaining spaces in the higher league will be determined at the end of the season by such applicable criteria as notified by the RFU to the clubs N.B. The position of the team(s) not eligible for promotion shall be disregarded in the event that a team would be promoted into a League in which another team of the same club plays, as prohibited by Regulation[ 13.2.4(b)(iv)]. Relegation for Counties and belowAt Counties 1 and below, the number of clubs relegated will vary and be determined based on such number of Constituent Body based leagues. After promotion has taken place in accordance with these regulations the requisite number of clubs or teams shall be relegated at the end of the season. This will ensure that in the following season there are in all Leagues, Counties 1 and below, the same number of clubs or teams as in the season before or such other number of clubs or teams as the Committee may decide. N.B. At Counties 1 and below if a first XV is relegated into a League in which the Lower XV from the same clubs plays, that Lower XV shall automatically be relegated as one of the requisite number of Clubs to be relegated. |
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tigerburnie
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Posted: 13 Mar 2023 at 12:23 |
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What happened to those lovely coloured charts someone put a lot of time in doing back in the day, I couldn't follow half of them but they were great.
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workerbee
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Posted: 13 Mar 2023 at 13:48 |
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The problem is not with next season but 24/25 if the provisional proposals go ahead then:-
Leagues below will be feeder leagues 6-9 12 teams This will regionalise league rugby and reduce travelling but it will also dilute all national leagues below Premiership 2. The decision the RFU will have to make are they going to fund the two Premiership leagues to make Prem 2 a fully professional league as the French have done with their leagues, you only need to look at last Saturdays result to see how much better they are with strength in depth, the England under 20's also got a hammering.
Edited by workerbee - 13 Mar 2023 at 13:49 |
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Camquin
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Posted: 13 Mar 2023 at 14:10 |
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So back to where we were before, but without National 1 and with smaller leagues and a ringfenced Championship. Deckchairs on the Titanic anyone. |
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Sweeney Delenda Est
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Raider999
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Posted: 13 Mar 2023 at 20:40 |
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The current situations bad enough - too many games with scores over 50 against the bottom 5 or 6, any further dilution at level 4 and the decent games of rugby will be limited to the top 4 orv5 in each division. Also if the number of games is further reduced clubs income will be hit hard. Spectator levels are definitely down since pre-covid days - I cannot see these ideas reversing this trend. |
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RAID ON
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Camquin
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Posted: 13 Mar 2023 at 23:24 |
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So
that is the current 14, plus 4 down plus ten from current level 4. So
you could have Cornish Pirates playing Ding's Crusaders, or Hinckley
playing Nottingham. Though, the ex-Championship sides will have had
their teeth pulled due to losing the current central funding (currently
they each get about two months of Bill Sweeney's salary) Darlington
will make some long treks South, Ampthill, Cambridge and Bury St
Edmunds could all go North. Pirates and Plymouth could have seven trips
to London. I am sure Barnes are not looking forward to coming back 330
miles in a coach after a 50 point hiding in Penzance.
At
this level you have roughly five sides in each league from old National
2 North and South and the other nine from Regional 1. There are going
to be some mismatches
So about two teams that would have been in Regional 1 and the rest from Regional 2. I
assume level 6 will be 16 leagues - and we are back where we were. By
this level, there would only be one side who would have been a league
higher. Frankly, the problems were all below this level, and the last reorganization failed to sort them out and introduced new ones.
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Sweeney Delenda Est
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kempstonblue
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Posted: 14 Mar 2023 at 07:45 |
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All this madness because silly people can’t run professional rugby clubs.
I was at Bedford Ath (Regional 1). Aside from the gap for the cup, the actual league it’s felt hasn’t been too bad. It took some clubs (Ath being one) time to adjust to a higher playing standard. But it feels like it’s working. Now looking at the above, looks a bit off. On one hand, splitting National one might help attendances, reduce some travelbut as highlighted still a lot of travel for others. However I think that level you still want to be seen as best in the country at that level. Does it need less teams, say 2x10, play home and away regional, then one game against sides in other region (27 games in total)?
Edited by kempstonblue - 14 Mar 2023 at 07:46 |
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The older I get, the more the RFU leave me confused.
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kempstonblue
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Posted: 14 Mar 2023 at 07:49 |
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More I read that, was the RFU sober when they thought these ideas through? Or in Huckleberryly Pearen panic that after Wasps, Worcester the rest of the cards would collapse?
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The older I get, the more the RFU leave me confused.
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Halliford
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Posted: 14 Mar 2023 at 12:03 |
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National League Clubs discussed the idea of the North/South split and a large majority was in favour, albeit that a current split would see Chinnor and Cambridge go North. It was agreed that it was important that the North designation continues to support the promotion of the 15-a-side code.
The one caveat to that, which was almost unanimous, was that there must be 13 meaningful Home matches for National 1 Clubs. The initial thought was two Leagues of 12 with 2 play-off matches between the two Leagues. These are only discussions, nothing has yet progressed as far as a recommendation so we can all have opinions and variations!
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@boatyjames
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Posted: 14 Mar 2023 at 12:26 |
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There must be playoffs for the top four to decide a winner - many clubs don't want to go professional but would want to aim to be the best semi-pro side in the country. Nat 1 has been a target for so many for so long they can't just decide there won't be a champion - surely.
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tigerburnie
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Posted: 14 Mar 2023 at 12:53 |
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Not keen on this play off thing, the side that is top at the end of the season should get the reward, rather than and end of season lottery. If the the top teams get promotion and there was a playoff for those who came second like there used to be, then that is different. A few years back Gloucester were top of the Premiership, then they lost to Leicester in the final, great for Tigers, but wrong on every count that the league winners got nothing at all.
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Camquin
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Posted: 14 Mar 2023 at 13:12 |
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But if there are two or three parallel leagues, who is champion.
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Sweeney Delenda Est
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tigerburnie
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Posted: 14 Mar 2023 at 13:51 |
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Each league has it's own and will get the reward of promotion, if there are two leagues and three promotions like Nat 2 used to be, then a playoff for the third promotion made good sense. Now there are three leagues and still only three promotion places, then the three winners get the places, to deny a team who has performed all season on the basis of a playoff has no grounds, morally or otherwise.
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Camquin
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Posted: 14 Mar 2023 at 14:09 |
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This is a pathological example. It would take a couple of unlucky, though not impossible, promotions or relegations. Remember, the three-way split at level 4 looked reasonable, until Chester ends up in the South-West. Colour coding indicates current level. Premiership 1
Bristol Ealing Exeter Chiefs Gloucester Harlequins Leicester Tigers London Irish Northampton Saints Sale Sharks Saracens Premiership 2 Ampthill Bath Bedford Blues Caldy Coventry Doncaster Hartpury RFC Jersey Reds Newcastle Falcons Wasps National North National South Birmingham Moseley Barnes Bishops Stortford Blackheath Bury St Edmunds Cinderford Cambridge Clifton Chinnor Cornish Pirates Fylde Dings Crusaders Hinckley Esher Hull London Scottish Hull Ionians Plymouth Albion Leeds Tykes Rams Leicester Lions Richmond Nottingham Rosslyn Park Sale FC Taunton Sedgley Park Worthing |
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Sweeney Delenda Est
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Front Jumper
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Posted: 14 Mar 2023 at 15:31 |
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Thanks guys for your info but how does it work at level 5, 6 and 7 with one promoted and two relegated then
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cheshire exile
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Posted: 14 Mar 2023 at 15:32 |
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How come you have Pirates at level 3 when we are above Caldy and Ampthill in the league table?
Edited by cheshire exile - 14 Mar 2023 at 15:32 |
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Front Jumper
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Posted: 14 Mar 2023 at 15:33 |
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how does it work Level5,6,7 with one up and two down from each league
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Camquin
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Posted: 14 Mar 2023 at 15:51 |
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Exile - because I was deliberately trying to make the worst case for the North South split.
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Sweeney Delenda Est
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Camquin wrote: