Round 6 Matches and Predictions

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The Blues

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Posted: 02 Dec 2023 at 23:42

Coventry ATT 3146 Thumbs Up

Camquin

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Posted: 02 Dec 2023 at 23:54

Obviously, I was not there, I have no idea what the state of the pitch was. This is purely hypothetical.

Under regulation 8, 23, in the three hours up to kick off, the decision to play rests with the two captains and the referee. Where all three agree, the game can be played, then the game goes ahead, everyone is happy - except the losing side.

If either captain disagrees, the game is called off, but the referee's opinion on the pitch is sent to the organisers along with notice of postponement.

If the referee is not happy, the game is off. They have to send in a report as to why. But they are assumed to be acting in good faith.

The dispute committee can then take action.

So, if the home Captain says the pitch is unplayable, then that is his right, the game is not played. Safety is of course paramount.

But if the referee says, the pitch was fine, it is more likely that the home club would have to pay the away club's expenses. If the referee agrees with the home captain, then the RFU has a hardship fund.

On the other hand, if the travelling team turn up and say, we will not play on that, the game does not go ahead. But if the ref says, the ground was in perfect condition - then there could be action taken against the travelling team. It has been known for a side struggling with injury to arrive and object to a pitch.

The home club should attempt to find an alternative venue, last season Sale moved their game against Cambridge from Edgeley Road to Carrington. Thank You, Sale, that proved critical to the season. Cambridge got the win. One more postponed match with the schedule pressure could have changed the season result.

If the match is called off early, swapping with the away side should be considered.

Sweeney Delenda Est

Bluesman11 View Drop Down

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Posted: 03 Dec 2023 at 09:33

Based on the above, I believe both the referee and Bedford captain wanted to play but Caldy captain declined, hence the game being cancelled. It sounds like Caldy will be liable to pay our travel expenses for the rearranged fixture (rightly so), but suspect the committee on Tuesday needs to go through the referee report and formally adjudicate one it. The main issue is why were Caldy seemingly happy to play at 11, but not 2. I also think the Caldy statement not directly apologising to the travelling fans (only making reference to their own fans) is also poor form.

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workerbee

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Posted: 03 Dec 2023 at 10:27

The decision to call of the game was a difficult one, there had been frosts every night from Wednesday but they were cleaded by the sun each day and the pitch was playable at 2.00pm On Thursday and Friday. Unfortunately on Saturday there as more Cloud although the sun did come out and the pitch lost the top frost and it was expected to be playable by 2.00pm but at about 12.00 heavy cloud prevented the expected thaw and there were still a number of areas which were dangerously hard and the team decided that there was a danger to them, incurring serious Injuries, possibly Career ending. For Caldy, who are semi professional players at best, their health and careers outside the game comes first.

Please look at the Caldy Website where the club has made a sincere apology to both Home and travelling fans but I am sure you will agree that in this litigious age Health and Safety comes first.

Big Eddie

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Posted: 03 Dec 2023 at 10:39

I was at the game so I can perhaps share some light on the circumstances:

1. A heavy frost on Wednesday night resulted in a frozen pitch on Thursday morning but full sun on Thursday resulted in a full pitch thaw by midday Thursday.

2. The same circumstances were in place Thursday night and Friday with the pitch fully thawed by midday Friday.

3. The BBC weather forecast for Friday night and Saturday morning was virtually identical to Wednesday through Friday with full sun expected on Saturday.

4. I arrived at the ground at midday and the frost was no longer on the pitch. However, Saturday morning had been unexpectedly overcast and the cloud cover and the light seemed to have gotten worse when I emerged from lunch at about 1.45 pm.

5. The game had been scheduled to kick off at 2pm and I was somewhat confused by the news that kick off was to be delayed by 15 minutes to 2.15 pm because I couldn't see much prospect of any improvement in conditions.

6. Shortly after 2.20 pm I heard the announcement that the game was not going to be played.

7. There was virtually no rugby played in the North West yesterday

I don't know how the decision not to play was arrived at but I live about half a mile from the club and when I got back home at about 2.30 pm my front lawn (which doesn't get full sun as it is shaded by trees) was still as frozen as it had been shortly before midday.

Caldy's Paton Field gets full sun and if the sun had appeared as forecast the pitch would have been perfectly playable. In my view the unexpected cloud cover was the culprit.

Edited by Big Eddie - 03 Dec 2023 at 10:42

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islander

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Posted: 03 Dec 2023 at 12:01

workerbee wrote:

it was expected to be playable by 2.00pm but at about 12.00 heavy cloud prevented the expected thaw and there were still a number of areas which were dangerously hard and the team decided that there was a danger to them, incurring serious Injuries, possibly Career ending. For Caldy, who are semi professional players at best, their health and careers outside the game comes first.

weird thing to say; seems to imply that a 'career ending' injury might somehow be worse for a semi-pro player than a fully-pro player... Confused

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Posted: 03 Dec 2023 at 12:09

Camquin wrote:

Obviously, I was not there, I have no idea what the state of the pitch was. This is purely hypothetical.

If either captain disagrees, the game is called off, but the referee's opinion on the pitch is sent to the organisers along with notice of postponement.

If the referee is not happy, the game is off. They have to send in a report as to why. But they are assumed to be acting in good faith.

The dispute committee can then take action.

So, if the home Captain says the pitch is unplayable, then that is his right, the game is not played. Safety is of course paramount.

If the match is called off early, swapping with the away side should be considered.

Protocol is;

Upto 3 hours before kick of an RFU official inspects state of pitch. They deem playable or not.

From 3 hours before KO captains and referee. If any and all decide either way that's the decision. If split decision referee will not deem game can happen.

If a team is travelling day before or early the RFU official will take into consideration state of pitch and weather forecast.

It's as simple as that.

Edited by Elijah Cadman - 03 Dec 2023 at 12:12

The Blues

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Posted: 03 Dec 2023 at 12:54

Blues are also semi-professional but I do understand that an injury may mean that they might not be able to do their day job but that risk is taken every time they go on the pitch irrespective to pitch conditions.

I heard the Blues squad were training for 30 mins on the pitch ready to go.

Blues were also told that the game should go ahead next Saturday which isn’t going to happen.

The bigger question is why does our division not have some form of minimum standards, at Blues frost covers would be on, blow torches and patio heaters would be on the pitch to sort any areas of concern. I can’t remember the last time Blues have cancelled a game, as everything is done to get the game on.

Also floodlights should really be expected.

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Posted: 03 Dec 2023 at 13:28

I do agree that at Championship level, floodlights should be expected.

Bedford have just put out a very brief statement:

“We are extremely disappointed and frustrated that yesterday’s game against Caldy at Paton Field was cancelled at the very last minute.

We thank our tremendous supporters who made the long journey north and will keep you informed of any outcome following Tuesday’s meeting of the RFU disputes committee.”

It does sound like we are going to argue to be awarded the win. From what other posters have put on here, it sounds like that isn’t the likely outcome though.

Edited by Bluesman11 - 03 Dec 2023 at 13:33

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islander

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Posted: 03 Dec 2023 at 13:34

The Blues wrote:

Blues were also told that the game should go ahead next Saturday which isn’t going to happen.

why not? wouldn't that count as the next available weekend?

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Posted: 03 Dec 2023 at 13:37

islander wrote:

The Blues wrote:

Blues were also told that the game should go ahead next Saturday which isn’t going to happen.

why not? wouldn't that count as the next available weekend?

It's a blank weekend, thought that's what they were put in for

Big Eddie

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Posted: 03 Dec 2023 at 13:45

The Blues wrote:

Also floodlights should really be expected.

Caldy is a village club that has risen from level 8 using their own players and without reliance on dual reg players from Premiership clubs. They are in the Championship on merit and in my opinion it would not be equitable to prevent them participating in the Championship because they cannot afford floodlights or frost covers......

Similarly it is against the spirit of rugby not to allow Caldy to aim for the Premiership because they don't have a 10,000 seater stand

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Camquin

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Posted: 03 Dec 2023 at 14:01

There have been cases of games being rescheduled for one week later.

It happened to Cambridge playing at Plymouth a few seasons ago.

Sweeney Delenda Est

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Posted: 03 Dec 2023 at 14:18

Camquin wrote:

There have been cases of games being rescheduled for one week later.

It happened to Cambridge playing at Plymouth a few seasons ago.

A few years ago due to weather postponements Donny played twice a week [Saturday then Wednesday] over a 5 or 6 week period. I'm sure my learned friend John Lowe can cast more light on this.

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